9mo ago

Americans in Puerto Rico can't vote for US president. Their anger at Trump is shaping the race

Puerto Ricans cannot vote in general elections despite being U.S. citizens, but they can exert a powerful influence with relatives on the mainland. Phones across the island of 3.2 million people were ringing minutes after the speaker derided the U.S. territory Sunday night, and they still buzzed Monday.

Democratic Vice President Kamala Harris is competing with Trump to win over Puerto Rican communities in Pennsylvania and other swing states. Shortly after stand-up comic Tony Hinchcliffe said that, “I don’t know if you guys know this, but there’s literally a floating island of garbage in the middle of the ocean right now. I think it’s called Puerto Rico,” Puerto Rican reggaeton superstar Bad Bunny announced he was backing Harris.

After Sunday’s rally, a senior adviser for the Trump campain, Danielle Alvarez, said in a statement that Hinchcliffe’s joke did “not reflect the views of President Trump or the campaign.”

199 comments

Why the fuck are US citizens not allowed to vote in a US election?
- Because each state is given the power to elect a president, not the voters. Puerto Rico isn’t a state so their voters aren’t represented properly.
  
  i mean the technicallity is that washington dc isnt a state either, so the better answer is that you need to live in a region where you have representatives.
  
  What happened to “no taxation without representation”..?
  
  What a shit system
- the electoral college values different things than the will of the populace
  
  Which was actually supposed to prevent Trump, but the founding fathers couldn't have predicted the modern world.
  
  This message was brought to you by Brando.
- History tells me that if the US is disenfranchising a group of people, it's usually racism
  
  https://founders.archives.gov/documents/Madison/01-10-02-0065
  There was one difficulty however of a serious nature attending an immediate choice by the people. The right of suffrage was much more diffusive in the Northern than the Southern States; and the latter could have no influence in the election on the score of the Negroes. The substitution of electors obviated this difficulty and seemed on the whole to be liable to fewest objections.
  The problem with the south, is that everything they do looks like it's all about racism, but they actually use their virulent and brutal racism to cover more evil selfishness. They're just monstrously racist as a hobby, corruption is their true passion.
- one more reason why the popular vote would be better than the shitshow this is
- Puerto Rico is a protectorate and has its own government. Puerto Ricans can't vote while on the island, but can vote in the US
  
  Every US State has its own government, too. I don't see that as an excuse.
  
  No, that can't be right, because half the comments here say it's due to racism. So if a Puerto Rican moves to a US state, they still can't vote, right?
Puerto Rico needs to be a state already. Washington DC too.
- What happened "no taxation without representation" that the colonists fought for in the war of independence? Apparently it only applies to white people.
  
  It definitely only did apply to white people. And only men.
  
  It was a lie from the start, it only ever applied to a few wealthy old white men who didn't want any cuts to their profit margins after the British fought a costly war to defend them from French and Native retaliation.
  
  That's why they don't pay federal taxes
  
  Same thing that happened to the WMD in Iraq. And the "good of the people" in Guatemala.
- Combine the Carolinas and Dakotas, add DC and Puerto Rico. No flag change.
  
  Got it, so North Carokota, South Dakolina, and DC and Puerto Rico. I think it’s a great idea.
  
  I was gonna say it's ridiculous to make DC a state, it's just a city!
  Turns out more people live in DC than Wyoming or Vermont LOL. So I'm down!
  Also I've heard that monkey's brains, although popular in Cantonese cuisine, are not often found there.
  
  Look man. I know NC is far from perfect, but don't lump me in with SC okay.
  
  Add DC, Puerto Rico, and Guam, and we have 53 states. 53 is a prime number, and therefore we would be indivisible.
- But first you should probably fix those islanders that aren't even citizens.
  Iirc making people citizenshipless is even against international law?
  
  Which islanders are you referring to?
  People born in Guam, the US Virgin Islands, and American Samoa all have American citizenship (just like Puerto Ricans).
  
  Sadly it’s not like that. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statelessness
  Canada, for example, withdraw the citizenship to children of Canadians that haven’t lived at least 1 year in Canada before 18yo
  
  Yeah, people can't have no citizenship.
- Puerto Rico periodically votes on whether or not to pursue becoming a state, becoming a state doesn't win except in one vote that was specifically a non-binding vote on the topic and that had much lower turnout than other votes on the idea.
  DC was literally created specifically to not be a state, so that no state held the seat of the federal government.
- Why does DC need to be separate anyway? Does any other country do it like that?
  Edit: yes, a few, but not really any I would look to as role models: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_district
  
  It doesn't, and the reasons for being that way are long in the past. The originally US wanted to avoid any state having the capitol at a time when states were more independent entities than they are now. People weren't really meant to live there at all. Politicians and there staff would travel in from the surrounding areas. Of course, it's evolved way past that, and the citizens of DC deserve the full representation of statehood.
- Edit: my information was out of date
  Tell the Puerto Ricans that, we're waiting on them reaching 51% in favor.
  
  They reached a majority vote in favor of statehood in the 2020 referendum. We're waiting on Congress. There's supposed to be another vote in this general election.
  Make them a state, or give them independence. The will of the people of Puerto Rico should decide, but the current status is untenable.
Taxation without representation
- the nation that started as a rebellion on this is doing the same thing to its own citizens? that's like building the land of the free using slave labor!
- Well as long as we don't live in an oligarchy I guess we're ok then
After Sunday’s rally, a senior adviser for the Trump campain, Danielle Alvarez, said in a statement that Hinchcliffe’s joke did “not reflect the views of President Trump or the campaign.”
His "set" absolutely reflects the views of Trump and his campaign. That is why he felt comfortable saying those things.
It's not like the racism of Tony Hinchcliffe was a secret that he kept carefully hidden from public view which caught the organizers by surprise. It took me about a minute of searching who this guy was before landing on the Tony Hinchcliffe Wikipedia page which covers his racist performance in Austin just 3 years ago.
- His whole set was also loaded into the teleprompter, so they knew what he was gonna say.
  
  This was my thought. Like I find it VERY hard to believe his set wasn't at least somewhat vetted beforehand. I cannot imagine they'd just let a comedian go up there and have absolutely no idea what he was going to talk about. That just seems like a total dumbass move so maybe it's possible with Trump
- I don't think I knew who he was back then. I looked it up and he's not even trying to be clever, there's no set up or premise, just slur. So cheap.
  Edit: timestamp link.
  
  there's no set up or premise, just slur
  Truly the pinnacle of Republican "comedy"
I can just hear those MAGA morons smugly chuckling, "What can they do LOL they can't even vote, fuck 'em!"
No, fuck you.
- I have no faith left in this country, he shouldn't even have gotten this far. I fully expect this to somehow raise his popularity, followed by a glowing endorsement from WaPp and Eric Adams
  
  The sad thing is that you may be right. I am quite sure that the separation of blue and red states will happen in my lifetime, and that it will be generally a good idea. Persecution of the outgroup will intensify, but there will be charities and support groups who help people leave the red states. Anyway, such persecution is already bad, even with a federal gov to try to keep things in check.
I saw a video of the 'comedy' that was said about Puerto Rico and I am honestly just fucking baffled as to why they hate them that much? I guess all they need to be to be hated is just be browner than they are.
Also how come the issue of Trump's disgusting behavior during Hurricane Maria and his refusal to fully help them beyond a stupid stunt that had him throw a paper towel at someone's face.
- A lot of them don't know that Puerto Ricans are Americans. So, add xenophobia to the racism.
  
  Man when I went to pr for a quick vacation the amount of people asking about passports floored me. I was like it’s a us territory how have you not learnt that in school?
  Also I got lots of local pr Spanish slang, they’re chill peeps and mofongo is the best. I think they should get statehood they’re bigger in population than the state I grew up in and it would be nice to shake up us politics with more senate seats.
- Brown bad
  GOP
  
  The GOP controllers aren't the racists though. They're rich, and puppets to the wealthy. In order to remain in positions of power, they create an enemy, in the form of bigotry and racism. Their sheep are racists. This is why though I trust very few politicians, I trust the Dems more atm because they are not using hatred and violence.
- I was thinking the guy is an idiot and meant to say Cuba but I have no idea. This is the first time I've ever heard anybody talk crap about Puerto Rico and it made no sense.
  
  I assumed he meant to say Haiti, which is still awful, but at least it would have kind of made sense...poorly.
  
  Trump has a bad record with Puerto Rico, hes shit on them a few times and blocked aid when they were hit with a hurricane during his admin
- They’re brown AND their country has a very Spanish sounding name. I can hear
  <insert drunk uncle>
  talking about it now: “any sumbitches from a place called PWER-TOE REEE-KO ain’t Mexicans just as much as any sand n*****s from Saudi Arabia ain’t AY-RABS!”
- I wish you were wrong
I’ve never understood the whole Puerto Rico situation. Your country was built on the rage of having taxation without representation. Why is it that Puerto Rico isn’t allowed to participate in your elections despite being US citizens?
- Because racism.
- Because our system is ~~broken af~~ designed and manipulated by powerful rich rascists who don't want to give up control.
- They don't pay federal income tax (but they do pay other federal taxes, like payroll taxes including social security).
- It's really racism. But if you want the legalistic explanation, here it is....
  The United States started out with 13 states that were all ex-British territories on the Eastern seaboard of North America. There are now 50 states. Every state after the first 13 got its statehood by first being a territory, adopting a state Constitution at a constitutional convention, and then getting that Constitution approved by US Congress, and so being "admitted to the Union."
  Under the Constitution, only states (and Washington DC) participate in the electoral college. The concept of non-state "territory" did not necessarily exist when that part was written, because there were only the original 13, and the Louisiana purchase wasn't done until later.
  [Washington DC is a very special "district" that is not a state and not a territory.]
  Puerto Rico has stayed at the territory stage since it was acquired in the Spanish-American war (started 1898). Why? Well, mostly racism. There have also been some popular votes in Puerto Rico, with very mixed results. In the currently evenly split political climate, getting any new state admitted is probably impossible (as it was before the civil war).
  There's also some undercurrent that maybe the US is kinda uncomfortable holding on to these overseas islands (which are mostly connected to the same Spanish-American war). Philippines became an independent country. On the other hand, Hawaii got statehood in 1959 (but there was a whole racist history there of white colonization).
  
  Yeah this is kind of the answer I was looking for. I didn’t really ask the question properly tho. Thanks.
- Because they don't tax them. Puerto Rico doesn't pay federal taxes
  
  While they dont pay income taxes to the IRS, they do pay customs taxes, federal commodity taxes, and federal payroll taxes (Social Security, Medicare, and Unemployment) to the IRS, which sounds alot like federal taxes to me.
After Sunday’s rally, a senior adviser for the Trump campain, Danielle Alvarez, said in a statement that Hinchcliffe’s joke did “not reflect the views of President Trump or the campaign.”
"All the stuff about you people being vermin that poison the blood of America, though, we meant that."
- What an incredibly stupid thing for them to say. This was an official election rally, and they 100% vetted every joke before he went out there. If they didn't, they're incompetent. So either way, their own weak ass defense is damning.
https://founders.archives.gov/documents/Madison/01-10-02-0065
There was one difficulty however of a serious nature attending an immediate choice by the people. The right of suffrage was much more diffusive in the Northern than the Southern States; and the latter could have no influence in the election on the score of the Negroes. The substitution of electors obviated this difficulty and seemed on the whole to be liable to fewest objections.
The electoral college was purely designed to let southerners use their slaves for votes. Letting Puerto Ricans vote doesn't help Southerners cheat.
Tell your hermanos, hermanas, amigos and amigas.
Reminder: The only reason Puerto Ricans cannot vote is because Republicans refuse to recognize it as a state, and they do that because they don't want brown people to vote, and they don't want brown people to vote because they don't want them to exist.
- As much as I hate the GOP, Puerto Rico has never attempted to apply for statehood. Their referendums on the subject have never shown a large enough amount of support for them to try a real vote. They're typically around a 50-50 split.
  
  State or not I think its pretty ridiculous that they are american citizens but can't vote for president of the united states... People living in DC get to vote and aren't living in a state.
  
  What are the main reasons they have for not voting in favour of statehood?
- Hear me out here, turn Puerto Rico into a state and combine both north and south Dakota into a new state called "One big Dakota". We wouldn't even need to change the flag, and the population of one big Dakota might break 5 digits.
Why is it that an American citizen living in, for example, France or any foreign country can vote but Americans in Puerto Rico can not?
- Because the U.S. is a failed democracy. It labels places like Puerto Rico as a territory.
  
  How are the Puerto Ricans represented in congress? Because not being able to vote for the executive branch is beginning to smell like taxation without representation.
- Because "No taxation without representation"? No wait, that doesn't make sense.
- The short answer is that deployment doesn’t count as permanent residence. You can still get a ballot from the state or territory that you used to reside in. You’re also required to pay federal, and depending on the state, state taxes.
  
  You can be a dual citizen and be living outside of the US and still vote. You can be an American citizen who has never lived in America and vote. It's not about permanent residency at all.
  https://www.usa.gov/who-can-vote
After Sunday’s rally, a senior adviser for the Trump campain, Danielle Alvarez, said in a statement that Hinchcliffe’s joke did “not reflect the views of President Trump or the campaign.”
Your team knew exactly who he is and you specifically invited him to be part of your event.
- The Trump team also asked him to remove the word C*** from his set before he went on and he agreed.
  The Trump team reviewed his set before he went on and did not have issues with Puerto Rico comments.
  
  They say he was going off script for that part. But of course they would say that.
I think the cluste4fuck that was the aftermath of the earthquake in Puerto Rico was a unifying moment for America.
Trump's supporters and haters all agreed that the President of Puerto Rico was a useless, arrogant, son of a bitch.
Puerto Ricans cannot vote in general elections despite being U.S. citizens
So, is anyone still under an ilusion that the US is a democracy?
- This is the case for all American territories. A statehood referendum has been put up multiple times throughout the years and there's never been a really definitive result.
  
  Some people there want independence, others want statehood, I was told. No consensus either way.
- This fact alone has no significant bearing on it.
  
  Do you know what a "democracy" means?
I really hope this is true and they can make a TRUE difference in the swing states. I was watching some interviews and in some cases there were Puerto Ricans that were annoyed but were still going to vote for Trump anyway!
I'm wondering what Kimberly Guilfoyle - Don Jrs half Puerto Rican girlfriend thinks about it. I'm sure she's doing mental gymnastics to justify it.
- To be in a relationship with Donny-lite, you would have to be a pretty awful person to begin with. I expect she hates brown people just as much as he does.
Can American citizens living abroad vote?
- Yes, they have a right to vote in the state they last lived in (or, if they never lived in one, perhaps the state their parent last lived in?) but unfortunately Puerto Ricans can't vote in presidential elections.
- Generally yes, but not in Puerto Rico. If they move to the mainland, they can vote for any elections there, but while living in Puerto Rico, they only vote for members of Congress that serve a mostly observational role.
  
  How about someone from new York moving to Puerto Rico vs moving to France?
is this a new problem?
Biden calling Trump supporters trash is far more damaging.
- After 8 years of Trump showing us exactly the kind of garbage person he is, the crimes he commits, the people he supports, how unpatriotic he is, the ideals and policies he endorses... if you're still in his camp mayhaps you are trash.
  
  Im not and I really don't care about proving people like you wrong.
- The double standard is eye watering.
  Trump painted ALL Democrats as literal demons for years. Not figuratively, like literally, you could fill encyclopedias with his rhetoric. And it barely moves the needle.
  But one gaff from Biden is damaging?
  Ugh. You are probably not wrong, unfortunately.
  
  Remember deplorables? All political positions aside you could argue this is worse than that. Deplorables has an intellectual level to it. It in an odd way almost sounds like a compliment.
  "She used a big word on us"
  This is just a mindless insult said by the current president against millions of people that would vote for more of him through Harris. It's a terrible look.
- Yeah I'm sure it pushed all the Trump supporters who were about to vote for Harris into rethinking their positions...
- No calling trash trash is fine
  
  But he didn't call trash trash
People need to lighten up. I heard his full set and it was hilarious and very toung in cheak *edited
- Why are you spamming all my comments?
- very young in cheak
  What.
  
  It's okay. They edited it to "toung in cheak." It's all fixed now. smh.
- no it wasn't.

199 comments