California Lt. Governor: ‘Explore Every Legal Option’ To Remove Trump From Ballot
California Lt. Governor: ‘Explore Every Legal Option’ To Remove Trump From Ballot
if enough states remove him, he'll cause a big enough fuss that he'll get 1/3 of the damn vote from loons writing him in
If he's disqualified then write in votes for him won't count either.
Technically they will count.
The issue is that he is ineligible to be president. The the same as if he was foreign born or under 35.
Don’t tell your racist uncle that though
To be honest, I just don’t see how he can be disqualified without a conviction. Among others, it requires state courts to rule on out-of-state conduct. For instance, in the (admittedly unlikely) event that the jan 6th charges against T are dismissed, should he be allowed back on the ballot?
Not all states allow write-ins. And some that do have very strict rules about them.
Or claim the election is already rigged, causing enough of his folks to stay home and NOT vote in other races that the house and state governments see unprecedented flips.
I think you might be underestimating the sheer laziness of voters.
I honestly think we’re going to see something very similar to J6 both in the run up and in the potential for it to turn violent. I think it could happen on a larger scale because the consequences have not been very harsh, except for a handful of minor players. There’s nothing that will keep Bobo and MTG and that whole rogues gallery from calling on people to “make their voices heard 1776 style” or some such euphemism. I don’t even know if they’ll bother with euphemisms at this point.
So now that Colorado has done it, do there even need to be future lawsuits in any state to follow?
I imagine there might be a lawsuit challenging the state doing it, but thats different than having to prove it in the first place like in Colorado
I'm no expert, but it seems logical that you could still win enough electoral votes from states that are not CO.
Dems have won CO every presidential election since 2008, so maybe not a huge issue for Trump? Again - I'm just guessing here.
The idea is that since Presidence has been set, more states will follow. But yes, probably still only states that wouldn't have voted for him anyway.
Let's hope more states do it. Maybe it would send a message to the boomers about a potential Trump 2nd term.
It's just the deep state afraid of the truth! Time and persistence shows the real intentions!
/s
The death of states rights here /s
Just convince them to try again next time after all of Trump's appeals surely succeed and he is ushered into the throne in the White House.
you don't need every legal option. the law is clear as day, all we need to do is follow it and wait for the openly corrupt supreme court to decide that it doesn't count in this case because they'd rather it didn't.
I see it more as to explore and close every loophole that could be used to prevent or discredit disqualification and make it as airtight as possible.
Get 'em California! Isn't it true the California bar exam is the most difficult out of all 50 states?
Louisiana has a completely different type of law than the other 49 states, so I think it would be a good contender for difficult bar exam.
That's its reputation, yes. Not sure if true.
Idk if that's a badge of honor. Maybe their laws are just more convoluted and hard to understand lol
It's due to their population. It's like 10 times bigger than most other states so there are a lot of competing interests. Also, California is the only contiguous state that encompasses its own geographic region that's not shared with any other states. I don't know that this complicates its laws necessarily, but it is just one more way in which it's unique.
Keeps folks like Alina Habba from popping up there... Jesus, she must have gotten her license out of a cereal box.
why? he doesnt have a chance in hell of CA anyway, why spin your wheels?
i guess im curious which of these states might split their electoral votes
Denying him primary delegates, saving money during the main campaign, and effects on down ballot races are all good reasons to kick him out. Also, yknow, following the constitution which clearly disqualifies Trump.
Yeah, the immediate benefit is the lack of Trump on the ballot in these states will hurt Republican candidates. Also, the Democrats will not have to spend money in these states.
All good points in response to your question, but here's another: He attempted an insurrection, and is constitutionally prohibited from holding office. It's in the 14th amendment, article 3. He's legally prevented to be on the ballot, but laws like that only work if someone enforces it.
I really want his to be the case but, to a laymen like me, the GOPs counterargument that he’s never been convicted of inciting insurrection is compelling. At least with the mental gymnastics SCOTUS and the GOP use. That’s why the special counsel’s and Georgia indictments are paramount, and why Trump’s team is fighting tooth and nail to delay them until after the election.
Let’s get every blue state, and then maybe a few purple states will follow suit.
That's not as likely to happen as you may think.
Purple states have purple or even red state governments.
If there's a chance Trump could win a state, then that state is already likely to have shitty voters that elected a shitty state government that will not jump to follow the blue states.
This is for the primary ballots so it would mean he cant win Republican primary votes in that state. That means another Republican candidate could beat him and become the nominee if I'm understanding correctly.
My guess: With the Colorado Supreme Court decision, he wants to build momentum of states disqualifying him. It would also send a message to the Supreme Court that this might be the right decision.
State rights used against the GOPoopers
If enough of a spook is raised about losing any chance of an EC win, or if enough conservatives try running to pick those states up themselves, it will divide the right wing ballot.
I mean they should still do it because it's the right thing to do, but yes it won't carry much meaning in the upcoming election.
No matter what happens with Trump, the present GOP is planning to seize and consolidate power.
So what happens if Trump wins the electoral college but California and other states don't recognize the insurrectionist shit bag?
How would he win the electoral college without being on the ballot? I guess more than half could write his name in.
If, say, half the states don't have him on the ballot though, that's a pretty unlikely thing to happen to win the necessary votes for the whole country.
If he's on in red states and purple states but not on the blue states.
I'm gonna be frank and say it's a long shot of Trump winning Colorado and California. He didn't win those states the last two times.
If he's not on the ballot in those two states, he could still win the EC as he did in 2016. The comment you're replying to is wondering what California and Colorado will do, should Trump win the EC.
I'm surprised this had to be said. 6 days before the balots are ordered.
“The constitution is clear: you must be (at least) 40 years old and not be an insurrectionist,”
DeMocRaCy aT woRk
explain to me why this and only this constitutional amendment should be ignored
Not trying to be hyperbolic but states selectively choosing who is allowed to be voted on as opposed to having it run as intended can cause a justification for a second civil war. This shouldnt be allowed. I dont care how vile Trump is to you. There is no rule that it can be left to the states to withhold votes in a federal election.
This isn't states choosing. It's the US constitution rightly preventing those who tried to destroy the country from ever holding office.
Section 3 of the 14th amendment. It's in the constitution. This Isn't just random fuckery, he incited a violent mob to try to overthrow the government, therefore he is ineligible for office. Because no shit, but ALSO because it's written into the rules of the country.
Read section 3 for me please. Tell me where it says the states can take it upon themselves to decide to absolve. It does say insurrectionists would be inelligible for office but its not up to the state to decide that.
But either way, shouldnt he be charged with insurrection before you make decisions like these? Literally proving his point that they will try any way to get him off the ballot, legal or not. I wonder why other states like Minnesota and Michigan refused to take him off the ballot...
Maybe don't try to overthrow the government, mmk?
Back in the day, pro-life people set up fake abortion clinics used to trick women - delaying their "appointments", forcing them to look at ultrasounds and not having people that could, you know, perform abortions. Democrats rightly passed a bunch of laws that forced any abortion clinic to, you know, perform abortions.
Then the republicans retaliated. They started passing ridiculous requirements - like going to the clinics and measuring door sizes then passing laws saying that doors need to be larger than what they had; then up-ing the ante by requiring "abortion reversing drugs" (that didn't exist) should women want to stop mid abortion.
Should Trump be disqualified enough to loose, look to Republicans to start passing ridiculous disqualification criteria. Supported BLM once? Well, BLM rioted once, so that was an insurrection and thus you are now disqualified from ever holding office. In fact, look for this happening anyways. Cause if a republican is in power somewhere, under their logic it is unconstitutional to challenge them.
"In her letter, Kounalakis acknowledged there would be 'political punditry' about a potential decision to remove Trump from the primary ballot but said 'this is not a matter of political gamesmanship.' "
Bullshit.
Not only is this gamesmanship, it's foolish gamesmanship... Dems are gonna shoot themselves square in the foot with this shit.
If you do declare trump ineligible, what goes on the ballot? You gonna have one of them third world elections with just one name on it? No, you're gonna have trumps mini-me clone... Fucking desantis...
You got Colorado right now. That's not gonna have a huge impact on it's own. Those electoral votes were going to be bidens regardless, so it's something the GOP can, and likely will, completely ignore. In terms of the gamesmanship, all thatx happened is Colorado having made a statement.
If California joins them, it's just as irrelevant (California's electorals also belong to Biden), however, it's now doubled as a statement. It's twice as loud, and half as ignorable.
The real danger is that a state that matters jumps on the bandwagon. Notably Arizona... If a state that has the capability to determine the outcome opts to bar trump, the GOP will drop him and run desantis in 50 states. You'll have every single red state supporting fucking desantis, and the potential to pull "martyr" votes in the battleground states for fucking desantis.
If you had to choose trump or desantis, would you go with desantis? That answer should definitely be no, because a lot of the shit cited as being what's wrong with trump is more attributable to desantis than to trump himself.
Dems are playing with fire with this bullshit, and saying it ain't gamesmanship is as valid in my opinion as trump saying he wasn't responsible for the rioting. Possible, but I got some doubts :)
Except that Trump is a crybaby little bitch who would never in a million years support Rhonda or anyone else for a position he feels is "his." He's more likely to encourage his rabid lunatic supporters to write him in even if it's not going to work, and plenty of them would. Then you'd have the Republicans who would be slightly more rational and vote for the actual nominee in hopes that there's enough of them.
I'm not saying it's impossible that we'll end up with a Republican president. I'm actually terrified that will happen. I'm just saying I don't think states expecting the constitution to be enforced are going to be the reason.
Political Gamesmanship
You're very verbose, but this is about all you're saying. But there's a reason these Supreme Court Justices (for Colorado) came to this conclusion other than "gamesmanship": It's the fucking right thing to do, and they believe in upholding the law and adhering to The Constitution.
Trump didn't just not call off his supporters attacking the very heart of our country's democracy, he didn't just incite them and gleefully watch the violence and chaos on TV, he didn't just violate his sworn oath to defend and uphold The Constitution, he didn't just demand his Vice President violate his oath and refuse to certify the votes, he didn't just send fake electors, he didn't just call senators and governors begging for more votes to be "found", he didn't just participate in other illegal methods of fraudulently attempting to stay in power... He did all of these!!!
He is legally inelligible to be president again, and we can't speak this truth enough.
You typed all this to say nothing of value.
No, it's the Constitution, plain and simple. He violated his oath of office, so he is ineligible to hold that office or any other again. The only way for him to become eligible is for Congress to vote that he is, with a two thirds majority.
Courts enforcing plain laws is gamesmanship?
If the RNC decides to unilaterally change their candidate to Haley or DeSantis or another candidate just because Trump is removed from a swing state ballot, I feel like Trump won't admit defeat and his supporters will just write him in or just not vote. His supporters are already distrustful of organizations like Fox. Winning any elections ever would become much more difficult for a long time.
Hey buddy, go check who filed the suit that got him booted in Colorado. Hint: their political party starts with an R, not a D.
Fascists aren't welcome on this platform. Truth social might be a better fit
/s/DeSantis/Haley
It will be Haley. Why would it be DeSantis, he's doing terribly.
Why do you keep saying "Dems" like this is some kind of decision arrived at by the DNC or the Biden Administration? This is the result of a group of attorneys and 4 judges in Colorado. I and everyone else in this thread had zero say in the matter. I even think you may be right that this ends up being a negative for the Dems. We will see.
That said, attorneys and judges being what they are, I don't see how this wasn't going to happen one way or another regardless of what anyone thinks about it.
Also, I would take Desantis over Trump in a heartbeat. Desantis would be bad, but he is not a gifted politician and doesn't have anything like Trump's cultish following and ironclad control over the cowardly leadership in the Republican party. There is no universe in which a president Desantis becomes a permanent dictator. He'd be lucky to complete a single term in office.
If you had to choose trump or desantis, would you go with desantis?
No I'd go with neither, because I'm a registered Democrat, so I don't get a say in the Republican primary in my state 🙂
Meaningless, he’ll never carry California, but liberals are setting a precedent that I guarantee will be used against them later.
Yes, if a Dem president incites an insurrection against the United States of America to illegally stay in power, I would absolutely support removing them from the ballot.
Liberals are weak fascist enablers but that take is not it lmfao
Fully agreed, but what if a Dem president is “allegedly” inciting an insurrection? In terms of electoral games, this is really one I would not want to play with the GOP. They will say that Biden is a traitor because he pulled troops from Afghanistan/the border/whatever other BS they can come up with.
With a conviction I would be fully in favour of removing Trump from the ballot. Without a conviction it’s just too easy for GOP to come up with a BS story. As a warning, many swing states are controlled by GOP.
I agree with everything you said except it isn't liberals setting a precedent. It is literally the legal standard set forth by the CONSTITUTION.
You are, however, correct that the GOP terrorist organization that is larping as a political party will certainly try to use this as a way to further undermine democracy. The question then becomes, how do you fight an opponent that is hellbent on usurping the rules in order to take over the country by legal fiat?
Well, should a Liberal incite an insurrection against the United States, that precedent should be used against them.
Tennessee State General Assembly: I saw a Democrat with a Biden T-shirt set fire to a trash can! It’s totally justified to disqualify Biden!
My State will sadly pull some stupid stunt like this for sure. I get your sentiment but for a lot of us red States our government will absolutely trip over themselves to demonstrate their “hold my beer” skills.
That’s not to say Trump shouldn’t be disqualified, but boy oh boy is it opening a box that looks like no one should open it. I really hope SCOTUS comes back and says something like “it went through three different courts and because of THAT reason we’re up holding it.” Just simply saying “well States should decide” will pretty much mean I’ll never get to vote.
As I understand it, so far, the courts aren't disputing that Trump incited an insurrection, they're disputing if the 14th Amendment applies to the office of the President.
The suit in Colorado was brought by 6 republicans.
what is the precedent? if you get yourself tagged as an insurrectionist, you cant be president?
or are you implying that conservatives are such outright, terrible human beings they would just lie in the future and call whomever they want an insurrectionist to keep them off the ballot? i think the morons down in texas already have that in progress
It definitely matters. Primaries exist. This article is specifically about the primary. He won the Republican primary in 2016 with nearly 75% of the vote.
Also, I'm pretty sure California awards the winner more delegates than any other state.
If that makes a difference, the RNC might just decide to go the DNC route and give themselves the power to ignore delegates and just pick a candidate if they so feel like.
It would have been used against them anyway, so they might as well use it where it actually applies.
We must save democracy by not letting people vote for him in a democratic election!
Umm.....what?
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but it's not that complicated. Constitution says he's not eligible, so that's that.
If you're going to try to destroy democracy with an insurrection you don't deserve to participate anymore
We voted last time and he lost and refused to accept his fate. He committed crimes (some of them against me as a ga resident who didn't vote for him). The law says you can't be president if you have supported insurrectionists. He incited the insurrection and even if you don't believe he wanted it to happen he still offered his support to the perpetrators after the fact. Even after they were convicted for insurrection. He literally did what it says he can't do. It's as plain as the hole in my ass dude.
Should we start allowing people under the legal age and non-citizens run for president without first amending the constitution to allow that as well?
If people want to change that outcome, then they should tell their representatives (the Constitution says Trump needs 2/3rds vote by both houses of Congress to be allowed to run for office in the US now) or amend the constitution. Its simply following the election laws that was accepted by the elected officials.
Someone who tried to ignore election results and incite a mob to overthrow the government? Yes.
And the precedent set by Colorado begins.
The question is will any purple states follow it. Trump was never going to win Colorado or California.
There's about a hundred different outcomes to this election that scare the shit out of me, but the one I'm stressed about tonight is the possibility that even after this, it'll make no difference, and then it'll be abused later on by red states in reverse.
We impeached Trump, they retaliated by trying to impeach Biden on weak pretense. We drop Trump from a ballot in blue states, they'll drop Biden in red states on some false pretense. Etc etc.
Even if it doesn't happen that way, it will take another form. I guess what I'm worried about isn't this specific event and it's fallout, it's the pattern of behavior. A democratic system can not operate when an entire party is hellbent on participating in bad faith, and increasingly willing to burn everything rather than accept a loss. No matter what twists and turns we take, it feels like it's heading toward the same eventual breaking point.
Which is why Democrats were doormats for so long. They were very aware of this and made concessions to maintain democracy.
Of course that didn't work. It's clearly not just a phase.
We can't just keep getting run over to maintain some false sense of decorum.
In regards to impeachment, there's precedent that impeachment for BS reasons doesn't resonate well with voters. Clinton was impeached for BS reasons (the process started with investigating his finances, before Monica Lewinski even worked in the white House). The following election, Democrats won a decent number of seats in congress despite Republicans expecting a Blue blood bath because of impeachment. Same with Trump, he was impeached twice (both of which Republicans said was BS), yet independents still voted for and continue to vote for Democrat candidates. I feel even Republicans know this, which is why McCarthy and McConnel, as well as other Republicans, feel this is a bad idea.
I feel like if this becomes a partisan trend of states whose reps/governors are up for election just kicking trump off the ballot it will only embolden his most angry voters, and energize those who are like, “well, I don’t care for the man, but I think the democrats are just out of control.” They don’t have to learn shit about the legal reasoning—in fact, they won’t. You have to assume no one will learn anything and they’ll just get the spin aimed at them. This serves as a boost to trump, i think
This is what truly matters.
We have to all agree on following the law faithfully/honestly, or else the center will not hold.
I don't think it matters if he would win those states as much as it may suppress MAGA turnout in those states, which ATM is a good thing.
I agree, but republican states need to find a legal way to remove Biden from the bailouts, if not I am sure that no matter what they try they will fail. Well I hope.
Maybe a few less votes as there are a fair amount of trump voters who can't spell his name on the write in?
There's one other thing to consider, that states where banning him makes no difference doing so will spark the fire of the reds in the purple states, making them vote more furiously.
Yeah. Isn't it great?
Colorado can't set precedent for California. Koulanakis is just so mind-numbingly stupid she thinks you need to be 40 to be POTUS.
I don't think the Lt Governor is the dumb one at hand, weirdly angry internet denizen.
And a state can, in fact, set precedent for another state in interpreting federal law, particularly the Constitution, as precedent is, and this will probably shock you, just precedent and not the law itself.
It is legally very simple to look at another state's interpretation of the Constitution and say "Yes, they had a good argument, that's the right way to do it."
She's off by 5 years.
You have to be a natural born citizen, be a resident for at least 14 years and be at least 35 years old in order to become president.
https://www.usa.gov/requirements-for-presidential-candidates