6mo ago

Trump suggests Ukraine shouldn't have fought back against Russia

www.nbcnews.com

Summary

In a Fox News interview, Donald Trump argued that Ukraine should not have resisted Russia’s 2022 invasion, claiming Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy should have made a deal with Vladimir Putin.

Trump criticized Zelenskyy for choosing to fight, compared the military strength of Russia and Ukraine, and said he could have ended the war quickly through negotiations.

Trump’s stance contrasts with Joe Biden's strong support for Ukraine, including aid and sanctions on Russia.

158 comments

So Ukraine, hear me out... Eliminate Trump and Putin during the negotiations, blame it on someone else. Everyone will thank you, and we'll get over it.
- I'm sure at this point if Zelenskyy pulled out a wellrod, popped both of them and said "Slava Ukraini" there would be a round of applause.
  
  If he does this, I'm getting Heroiam Slava tattooed on my chest.
  
  i honestly don't think anyone would put him to trial. like suddenly everyone you know was with the president of ukraine at the time of the incident. and sure, that's not what questions the ICC would be asking, but that's what we'd all be saying
  
  It would almost certainly be a requirement to prosecute and then likely lock Zelenskyy up if he did that, even if he might be doing us all a favour. And even the nicest prison is still a prison.
  It would be better if there was a way to have the targets neutralise each other.
  
  Firstly, he'd need two Welrods. Those things aren't exactly quick to reload.
- Downside is you'll have JD Vance as president. Unsure that'll be any better.
  
  Vance has a brain, which is both scarier and more reassuring at the same time.
  
  I'm not sure anybody would rally behind him. He had the lowest likability score of any VP pick since 2000 - even below Sarah "I Can See Russia From My House!" Palin.
  
  JD Vance only eats the cat food part of lucky charms pass it on
- You'll have millions/billions of people willing to be your alibi. "According to people calling in, Zelensky was at 300,000 bars, sleeping on 1,250,000 couches, and attending 13 Bar Mitvahs that night, so he couldn't have killed Trump and Putin."
  
  "Absolutely top-notch guy. Literally omnipresent.
  Like me and all my friends were having individualized, concurrent, and meaningful bottle episodes with the guy.
  Just the consummate gentleman."
- The problem is who will replace them. Does Putin even have an official successor (like the US VP), or would this create a power vacuum?
  
  The Prime Minister is de jure the acting president in case of a vacancy. Given the strength of legal institutions in Russia Mikhail Mishustin would have some work ahead of him to actually hold power.
  
  So believe it or not back when the USA had its shit together we had this thing called the CIA and boy were they pretty good at identifying and exploiting power vacuums to the advantage of our country.
Rapist claims victims shouldn't fight back. More at 11pm
- Oh. Wow. You win.
  If that rooftop guy could hit the mark like this comment did, we wouldn't be having to listen to his chaotic-evil nonsense right now.
Ukraine HAD a deal with Russia ensuring its peace and its borders. It was called the Budapest Memorandum. Russia was the one violating the deal Russia had agreed to.
- I think you're confused that was the treaty that said NATO couldn't come within forty thousand miles of its borders and what about Biden's Ukrainian money laundering bio-facilities?
  
  In case anyone is thinking of taking this troll seriously, there is no treaty that prevents NATO from expanding east. There was something like it between NATO and the USSR but Russia officially is not the successor to USSR so they have no claim to that guarantee. It's all Russian propaganda.
This is literally all the “anti war” arguments. George Washington should have just stopped resisting the red coats.
- Washington was part of a revolution. This is an invasion. More like Russia should have just let Napoleon have it.
  
  Sure, but that makes it entirely unrelatable to the Americans making these arguments.
  
  It's kind of a revolution though because it all started with Maydan and the ousting of Russian puppet Yanukovitch.
Convicted rapist says victims shouldnt fight back
“Just lay there and take it.” Is Trump’s motto
- It sounds right in content and in him not knowing that lay is a transitive verb.
  
  A WHAT-itive verb?!?
  shits out a new Executive Order
The annoying orange should not be discussing matters he knows shit about...
- But then the only things he can talk about are rape, treason, paying for sex, and shitting his pants
  
  Dude come on. That's not true.
  He also cheats at golf a lot.
  
  Golden showers
- That's impossible, because he can't keep quiet.
  
  And knows shit
Of course he did. Trump would never stand up to a bully, he would never defend the weak against the nasty. That would take courage, but Trump has only cowardice and sycophacny for bullies.
Trump is a person who sucks up to bullies, and punches down on the bullied, through and through.
Ugh. I guess it’s starting. Anyone placing bets on how long before Trump does a complete about-face on the situation and starts running joint missions with Russia against Ukraine? I’m morbidly suspicious that might really be how things end up.
- This isn't exactly a secret. Remember in the debate when he said he'd end the war, and refused to say which side he'd be on?
Trump is a little bitch. Doesn't know what being a man is, because if he did, he'd do the opposite of this.
- It's worse. I doubt he knows what being a human is...
So president of a nation that has the motto "give me liberty or give me death" is saying this.
- The people who voted for him tend to prefer "Don't tread on me" which makes it even more ironic.
  
  Well yeah, the full saying is "Don't tread on me, tread on ukraine instead". They just shortened it
  
  Any time I see those stickers, flags or license plates I have a deep urge to reenact the curb stomping scene from American History X using the person who has it/them.
Of course the convicted felon would say that Ukraine should just lie down and let Russia grab 'em by the country.
You might not believe me but anyone can just walk into maralargo. Trump won't have you trespassed, he will offer you a cash deal to leave. Trust me, it's true. Ez money.
- This is why he's having such a hard time getting Musk to leave. How do you make a problem go away when your only problem solving skill is bribery and your problem is a higher degree of wealth than your bribing power?
Fuck Trump you spineless corporate shill
America hasn't had to deal with the recieving end of Imperialism for almost 250 years. (its been on the giving end of it for the last century) America is in no position, not Trump, not Elon, not Biden, not the dude that just wants to grill. None of them are in a position to tell someone not to fight for freedom, when there is an actual threat of losing ones freedom and sovereignty. Most western countries have long forgotten what the struggle is all about because they've had their freedom for centuries.
Ukraine's fight has been going on for centuries, but 2022-Present has been the defining moment of that fight.
If you aren't going to help, shut the fuck up, and fuck off and let the rest of us handle it. Ukraine isn't going to stop fighting for its existence just because Part of America is tired and upset about superficial things like egg prices. If America isn't going to carry the torch of Liberty, there are plenty of others willing to take it from here.
- Europe is having its issues too. It seems like the people are mad about taxes already, and aren't keen on the prospect on increasing them for military spending. They've already run huge deficits for COVID.
  Many other powers are either not interested in this particular fight or can't afford to be.
  I hate to sound so cynical, but I think Zelensky is smart to "work with" Trump (aka manipulate him) instead of denouncing him and kicking him to the curb like his country has every right to, because the drive to fight only goes so far against a truly genocidal adversary.
Honestly I'm more worried about the NATO 5% thing which is blatantly designed to fracture the alliance.
The number was 2%, and many didn't hit that. 5% is never going to happen and is going to be Trump's cause to pull out, mark my words. Thankfully Congress put some stops in there, but doesn't mean Trump can't fuck things up bigly.
Ukraine can schlump along with NATO sans USA, but no NATO and Ukraine is finished.
- If European countries somehow manage 5 percent, it’s Europe that should step out of NATO. At this moment I am half convinced it’s better to have a strategic alliance with China than with Trump.
  
  Europe wouldn't even need additional allies if they were all spending that much.
- As a Canadian, good. I'll worry a lot less about American invasion if we have our own separate NATO ~~with blackjack and hookers~~.
Really? So, Mexico can take back what they lost and the USA will not resist.
- If by that you mean Texas? Please take it back.
  
  Only if they take Florida also. Package deal.
“They’re saying ‘the war is tomorrow’ – this causes panic on the market and elsewhere," Zelensky, Jan 2022 in response to US warnings of imminent Russian invasion.
Zelensky didn't "choose to fight" because Russia insisted there would be no fight right up until it crossed the border. It would've been considered a sneak attack but for the US telling everyone Russia was invading for a full month in advance. There was no choice offered to Zelensky and never has been since, unless you count Russia's current stance of basically "give us all your weapons and maybe then we'll negotiate"/
Does he really believe this, or is this redirected anger because he's finally figured out that he can't, in fact, just solve it?
Probably, Putin told him to pound sand, and then OPEC basically just ignored him when collapsing oil prices was the next idea.
- Putin didn’t tell him to pound sand. Putin holds the leash. Everything Donald Trump says and does is to advance Russian interests.
  
  I see little evidence of that. At most Putin has a small amount of leverage on him. Basically, there's just a lot of stuff good for Putin Trump could do but doesn't.
if only he hadn't fought back against being prosecuted.
he'd be in prison... or on death row... and we wouldn't be in this mess---again.
~~"Trump suggests Ukraine shouldn't have fought back against Russia"~~
"Trump demostrates how little he understands about the conflict in Ukraine"
FTFY
No deal can be made with Putin when the ruthless conquest of rebuilding a Russian empire is Putin's goal.
Preparing the people of Greenland....
- And Canada?
  The 51st state
  In his inaugeration trump literally mentioned he wants the US to grow in territory.
  
  And freaking why? When people are still struggling with basic shit like food insecurity in the borders we already have.
  I know I'm asking this rhetorically and it's all ridiculous it's just...why???
This just confirms that Zelenskyy has a way bigger ball count than Trump by two.
It's easy to say don't fight back when you're not the one getting beaten up and mugged
- Well, what was Ukraine wearing? Maybe they were asking for it?
  Obviously /s
Glad to see the ghost of Neville Chamberlain is still around.
- C'mon, if we're doing WWII analogies he doesn't get to be an allied leader, even if Chamberlain was a really bad one.
Trump is a malignant narcissist, and I'm pretty sure that's a requirement to have that opinion.
I assume he would have said the same to Poland at the start of WWII?
- Well, this is not the best argument given Poland's history of being nonexistent for 123 years until a deal was made. On the other hand, the German-Russian invasion of 1939 is the prime example of a war of aggression.
I can't imagine what would have satisfied Russia other than complete surrender. Ukraine had few other options than to fight. Uphill as their battle may have been.
Why would he say something so easily disproven at this point? If Ukraine should not have fought back they would have been defeated already.
- Why would he say something so easily disproven at this point?
  His reputation for honesty and good judgement is ruined!
As in 'becoming a part of Russia isn't too bad actually'? Because that's what would have happened if they hadn't fought back.
What American doesn't jump at the chance to fight Russia?
- Conservatives
- They both have nukes
  
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutual_assured_destruction
  
  There are days when the nukes would be preferable to the endless news cycle of stupidity. Would you like to play a game?
Yo. You know. Screw him. Slava Ukraini!!!
Donald Trump argued that Ukraine should not have resisted Russia’s 2022 invasion
*Trump was an idiot as usual, arguing (...)
Your leader is stupid and a complete wuss.
Your leader.
- Our President. By election. He isn't wanted by many, and is definitely no leader.
Well yeah, and now he's taking this move from Putin's playbook for Greenland. He's at the "people in Greenland would rather be US citizens" stage. Putin did the same thing in the beginning when talking about the territories in Ukraine he wanted to take.
He can 'make a deal' with me as I take his real estate portfolio off his hands.
But the US has the most powerful military on the planet under president Trump? Power is useless if it is not used and guided well.
What a POS
Why people keep listening to what that being says? Just respond to his actions, anthing else is useless...
- That being controls almost 50% of the world's nuclear arsenal. That's why.
  
  So? He will do as he pleases, doesn’t he? Why even answer when he changes the name of a geographical landmark, threat with invasions or economic punishments? He is a bully, the most useless thing to attempt with a bully is trying to speak him into reason or concede him the recognition of dialogue capability, it just let him to probe the breaking point of the abuse, there should be zero tolerance to such being, and urge to back up all the dependencies with other allies asap, the alternative is submission up to nearly the breaking point of the abuse. That’s my opinion…
- Why people keep listening to what that ~~being~~ turd says? Just respond to his actions, anthing else is useless...
  ftfy
I'm kinda getting a "if you're getting raped just lay back and take it" vibe from this.
There should be a geopolitical literacy meter that has a red sector named after Donny-boy.
- Gotta add another line to the list of civ 5 victory score ranges below Dan Quayle
Trump is chose to continue giving aide to Ukraine. This is just bullshit so he can appear to be trying to lower taxes
- I wouldn't be so confident about that, considering that Trump is known to spew so much bullshit that the truth is hard to parse from it.
Lemme just invade the us on a whim then
Of course he does.
OTOH, I also heard him quoted trying to get Saudi Arabia to flood the market with cheap oil to try and force Russia to the table. Makes sense, since oil has been the last big export Russia has to make money on. I'm opposed to Trump and his stupid fucking Nazi pals on pretty much everything, but I guess even broken clocks can be right twice a day. It'd be nice to see this meat grinder closed down with a treaty, instead of the US deciding to do a rugpull on Ukraine. Ofc, I support the Ukrainian people's right to self determination. If they want to keep fighting, that's their right, but putting Russia on an economic back foot would probably meaningfully help negotiations.
Source (didn't read, heard about it on NPR)
https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/23/oil-turns-lower-after-trump-says-hell-ask-saudi-arabia-and-opec-to-bring-the-price-down.html
- But this just makes sense if russia would be sanktioned before. Because if russia wouldnt have started a war, russia could still sell and buy everything. So if the oil price dumps there wont be the same effect as now.
  
  Aren't the Biden era sanctions still active? IIRC, sketchy off grid oil sales and sales to India/China are basically what's keeping Russia going at this point. If the market gets flooded with cheap OPEC oil, that would be a major baseball bat to the knee.

158 comments