Anybody who bought a Tesla in the last few years is a goddamn tool.

other sodium, tear filled comments from fools whose opinions don’t matter.

You know you can post an unpopular opinion without being a completely unlikable cunt, right?

- That's probably because OP is posting a popular opinion in an unpopular way.
- It's as if OP posted two unpopular opinions.
I struggled with this for a long time on that other site. I'm trying to do things differently here.
- I had a blanket "Cool guys don't look back at explosions" policy to posting on pretty much every other site. I decided to turn over a new leaf on the Fediverse, and try not to post anything I don't actually want a reply to. It does tend to gentle you down a bit. Also, I noticed other people were at least giving themselves a chance to form friendships that way, so yeah, new deal.
  The thing that really sucks about social media is how many people are just using you as a vent pillow to scream into. It's amazing that so many people are using so many websites that pretty much amount to somebody else's emotional punching bag.
- Yeah, Digg wasn't great
I mean being unlikeable is unpopular so... it fits lol
- What's immortality gotta do with all this
Nah, he is just a troll and attention lover.
Is this even an unpopular opinion? Feels like everything musk touches is anathema nowadays, at least here on Lemmy.

I've had mine for 5 years. I wanted an EV and at that time (in the US) there really was no option even remotely close with the combination of range, charging convenience and technology.

Elons downfall sometimes makes me slightly embarrassed to be associated to it in any way, but its still a great car, not perfect but great. 5 years and I've had to replace a set of tires, wiper blades and fluid, and 2 sets of cabin air filters. That's it.

Its popular to hate on Elon and its rightly deserved but come the fuck on.

- Tesla pulled a hattrick by making people who couldnt give a shit about the environment want to buy an EV, and they did that by making the car pure fun.
  With all the major brands announcing support for the NACS connector I will be keeping Rivian in my sites in a few years. If they can get the price right for their next generation, lower cost models they could be a compelling package.
- Good point. My car has 55K miles. Recommended lifespan for the factory tires being 30K, I was dumb and ran the original tires till 34K miles.
- I've got 92k miles on mine but my experience mirrors @Redonkulation@lemmy.world. On my 3rd set of tires

As a BMW driver, I am pleased that there is a new asshole driver car

We'll come back to you when the discussion circles back to turn signals.
- As with any classicBMW@lemmy.world, its because the signals are broken, like most of the rest of the car.
- At least some of the blame has to go right back at BMW for that, the fact that they insist on making a turn signal stalk that doesn't stay in the down/up position until you turn the wheel blows my mind.
  Oh yeah, the wiper stalk is the same way so you can't ever tell what speed it's set to lol
No, beemer and audi drivers are still worse. At least Teslas park within the lines.
- I will respectfully nod in your direction for the correct usage of beemer. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to not use my turn signal

I can write from a Company perspective with multiple EVs. All Tesla models except X. We have VW Golf E, IDs, Mercedes EQS, E-Tron, Polestar and some mercedes E-vans. I've driven all of them...long range, short range, multiple months. And in the price range of 45-55k€ nothing beats The Model Y (2022). Its a great car. Tesla has made a great leap in quality from 2020 to 2022. We have Model 3s from different years, and the difference is huge. The recent ones are stellar for their price....no comparison with anything else on the market. This will certainly change quickly in the next years. The supercharger grid is also the single best feature.

Also...I can distinguish between a car and a delusional apartheid willy wonka.

The Model Y (2022). Its a great car. Tesla has made a great leap in quality from 2020 to 2022. We have Model 3s from different years, and the difference is huge.
And let me say as someone who has been driven in a plethora of Teslas as Uber/Lyft vehicles… they have not lol. Squeaks and rattles on brand new 2022-2023 cars is just embarrassing. Trim pieces falling off is just pathetic.
Maybe they should use some of their “industry leading margins” to invest in a QA team because as it stands there is no QA at that company.
- Could be dependant where they're manufactured. We've about ten 3/Ys; non squeaks or rattles to my knowledge. I've had a Model S couple years ago (pre Model 3 era) liked the car, but the quality wasn't there for the price. Had a Volco XC90 before that. Switched to a Model 3 for about 1-2 years, (tax reasons) - the build quality was bad...everything felt really cheap. After that We've got some of the first Model Ys from the German factory. (You get some tax incentives in Germany when your new EV is below 60k€). We've also got some 3s. The build quality difference was staggering. I still miss my Volvo...but the Model Y is close second. Just two days ago I've driven over 1000km across Germany...no squeaking. ;)
  Just the damn freezing door handles in winter drove me crazy...but now you can pop the doors open via app.
The supercharger grid is going away as an advantage. Also, if you bought last year, a Model Y was starting at $67,000. I almost bought one, and I'm so, so, so glad that I didn't.
- It was about 58.500€ for long range dual drive, and as a business you got some incentives. And yeah...the advantages are slowly going away...but they are still there. Most of the time the supercharger are cheaper (like 0.34€/kW at a SC and 0.69€/kW at aral pulse or ionity.) And better positioned.
So very helpful...
Just hope your company doesn't cross Elon Musk or Tesla, because then their Tesla cars could suddenly stop working. They have done it before, I've never heard another company do that.
Also…I can distinguish between a car and a delusional apartheid willy wonka.
Except you can't really, because there are many other issues than how pleasent the car is to drive. Tesla is infamous for their monopoly repair service, where a tiny valve can cost the owner an entire new battery! There are so many documented cases that Tesla repair is outrageous, that that alone is cause to never buy a Tesla.
- Anyone who says they can buy a Tesla and sleep well at night because they don't give a shit about Elon Musk are the same people still listening to R Kelly.

If liking the CEO is a prerequisite for buying the companies products I'd better start learning how to live off the land

Not a bad idea. We should all do that. Seriously.

Sir this is unpopular opinion, not based opinion.

I've driven probably close to a hundred different Teslas and nearly every electric car currently on the market over my career working with cars, and I completely agree with this take even when you remove Elongated Muskrat and the semi-functional, utterly misrepresented Autopilot entirely from the equation. Sure, a Tesla (in proper working order) feels really good to drive, but practically every other electric car on the market (outliers being the Leaf and the Bolt) are working as hard as they can to capture that same experience and most are doing a really good job if not exceeding that standard. The only differences are that most other manufacturers have what I have to assume is a massively more robust design and engineering team, better quality control, and generally decades upon decades more experience in designing cars in general, and not taking advantage of that as a buyer is a pretty dumb move, especially when you start researching the myriad issues with Teslas. Sure, Tesla may have kickstarted the electric car market, but with all the current, similarly priced options on the market, buying a Tesla is purely for the status-symbol optics or because you actually buy into Elon's BS, which is its own can of worms.

If you were to recommend an EV today based on your experience, which one would you suggest and why?
- Well, it depends pretty heavily on price point. Assuming you're looking at the middle-to-slightly-upper end EV market and have a Tesla Model 3 on your list, I'd suggest the Mustang Mach-E. Of the upper scale EVs I've driven, it's honestly surprising how good this thing feels despite all the mental gymnastics involved in it being called a "Mustang." Ford has honestly been killing it with their line of EV offerings, especially the interiors and controls. It's so far one of the only ones I've driven where I've said I'd own one (if I could afford it.)
  On the less expensive side of things, the Chevrolet Bolt kind of surprised me with how solid it felt as well. They're way cheap even in comparison to even the Nissan Leaf (I have not driven a current gen Leaf but the older generation were AWFUL) and from what I've seen from the now dead Volt (I know, not an EV but the same general idea) Chevy seems to skew towards well-thought out, overengineered products in this category, unlike some of their traditional offerings. Side note: I think the issue with them catching fire is overblown and not unique to Chevy - it's more a limitation of current battery tech and Ford, Tesla, and practically everyone else has had issues here too.
  Kia's EV6 and Hyundai's Ioniq 5 also seem surprisingly nice, although they're not exactly what I'd consider cheap. I can't comment much more on them though because while I've been around them, I haven't had the chance to really drive one yet, but I have driven a slightly older Kia Soul EV (not currently sold new in the States) and was blown away at how nicely appointed they were and how solid they felt for a subcompact, so I have to assume it's an even better experience than that.
- Recommend an EV today in NA? It depends on your use-case. Do you ever want to drive cross country in any meaningful amount of time? Your answer is unfortunately Tesla because of their vast charging infrastructure.
  Do you want a city driving and will reserve your cross country driving to a gas powered vehicle? Just about any other EV would be better.
- If you can afford it, the Mercedes EQE is awesome, but it's a sedan so cargo space is limited. I don't know about the SUV version. I prefer wagons to SUVs because they're more practical. More space and better comfort for same money usually, as SUVs have bigger profit margins. There's also a Shooting Brake version coming possibly, but it looks a bit weird and it's still 2 years out.
  The Ioniq 5 wasn't very nice compared to the '03 Mercedes I owned while I test drove it, I was disappointed with its' ride quality, but as a vehicle for someone who's not very demanding in that department, it seemed great.
  Avoid the hell out of the Skoda Enyaq. Not comfortable, not cheap, not fast. Idk if it does anything well. I suppose there was decent legroom in both front and back seats.
  The upcoming Volvo EX30 will be super fast for its price if you're into that sorta thing, but also super minimalistic, and touch-screen based (newer Mercedes sadly have the same problem). Let me adjust the climate settings with physical switches!
- I'm probably not as experienced with electric cars as OP sounds to be, but I really enjoy driving the VW ID3 whenever I get to rent one. It's compact, drives sporty and has a good interior IMO.
If the Bolt/EUV fits your use case it is an unmatched value. I love mine so much. I hope they make an Ultium version by the time I'm ready for a new car.
Also work with cars and absolutely agree. Tesla may have kick-started the market but as a rule in general you're usually better off going with the engineers that have more experience under their belt. The exceptions being if the company is cutting corners to save money which Tesla is supposedly doing anyway so yeah, I'd go with the other guys.

The billionaires want us to fight each other, don't fall for this trap.

Fuck everything about that clown Musk, but no one can deny that Tesla makes a compelling case when you just look at only the cars and the network.

The funny thing is that one of the biggest advantages that Tesla has had - namely that charging network - will now be open to basically everyone since North America seems to be switching all to their adapter. So in one fell swoop, they have lost their biggest advantage.

And as more vehicles come on-line from other car makers, they will lose their other advantage, but they are still Top 3 in all the categories they compete in. To claim otherwise is ridiculous. And I say that as someone who would never consider a Tesla to a large degree because of Musk and their god awful build quality and anti-consumer and anti-worker tactics.

Losing their biggest advantage to sell cars, sure; but that network still costs money to use, right? Presumably all those other non-Teslas looking to use it will be paying to do so? I mean, talk about making it up in volume.
OTOH, I don't know about the economics of this; I'm happy to learn things that might invalidate my thoughts here.
- Chargers are not like gas stations. Most people will do the vast majority of their charging at home. I only use a public charger when I am doing a road trip. And even then, I still have the option of using Electrify America or Chargepoint chargers. So yes, it would be amazing for me to access the supercharger network if it allows for a more efficient route than relying only on Electrify America, but realistically I would only be charging there once or twice a year, maybe $30 each time.

I'm not sure why you think lemmy is full of Musk fans, but I think you'll find the guess to be incorrect. There's not a lot of Tesla drivers on here. I know that because for the most part, the only people that are here, are ones capable of doing a little research. Ones capable of doing a little research, probably won't buy a Tesla. People who do research on stuff definitely research their vehicles.

There's probably a handful of people that got the early generation stuff, but probably not many. Anyways, have fun.

I bought a Tesla in 2018. I did my research. It’s the best car I’ve ever owned. I’ve driven it from Mississippi all the way to Washington state with no issues. It’s so cheap compared to a gas car too. I pay maybe $9.50 for 300 miles, which is way cheaper than 5.50/gallon of gas.
The drive assist is amazing in longer trips. The city “self driving” isn’t great, but it’s great to have lane keeping and distance keeping in terrible traffic.
I can turn on the AC and view my cameras from the app. What’s another car company that can view 4 angles + inside from the native app? It really helps when I have my dog and need to check in on her when dog mode is active.
Don’t get me wrong, I hate Musk, and he would probably dissuade me from getting one today.
- Sounds to me like you are just a fan of electric drive trains and connectivity. None of these features are particularly unique to Tesla. Except maybe the inside camera part. Yuck, no thanks.
- I may have bought one back in 2018 also if I was looking to get a car.
Wow... I knew there wouldnt be a lot, but didnt think it would be this bad.
- Wow F me, even a Tesla Investor community too 😯
  I wasn't expecting so many Tesla communities to exist here already though, kinda surprising and insightful
- Christ, why don't they combine their powers? This is Lemmy not fucking Reddit. I guess they can talk in RealTesla (note: I say "they" because I don't own a car/Tesla, not because I hate Elon, though he is certainly an insufferable wanker).
- Heh yeah I thought it'd be more too. lol
Looks like there is at least one Tesla fan judging by the down votes (at the time of this comment that is).
- I downvoted the comment because I find that saying that Tesla owners aren't "capable of doing a little research" is not just untrue, but also unnecessarily belittling/insulting.
  I personally would never buy a Tesla but I disagree with insulting people's abilities on the mere basis of them choosing to buy a Tesla.
  (I downvoted your comment because I disagree with randomly making up reasons for a post/comment having downvotes.)
- There's always a trace number of people downvoting everything that doesn't jive with a strict conservative doctrine, so you have to normalize for that. It's usually at least 1 on here.
  Given how annoying this place would be for any genuine conservative to actually hang out in for any length of time, I conclude we're actually being monitored by someone(s).
- You know you can see who's downvoting right? It's a lurker account with "Texas" in the username. Make of that what you will.

Elaine

Gender shaming? What the fuck does your projected gender issues have to do with anything?

Elon Musk is a vocal transphobe. So misgendering him is meant to insult him. Even though he will never read this thread.
- Yea somehow stooping to his level diminishes the impact of this point.
- Misgendering a transphobe is still transphobic. It's still a big stinking "fuck you" to a bunch of people walking by who have nothing to do with the bug up OP's ass.
  Look, you wouldn't call him a "fag" because he's homophobic, right??

Electric vehicles with drive assist are awesome and are the future

If you mean future as in save the environment, then I disagree. Individual transport as a mainstream mean of transportation is the problem. What we need to save ourselves is to replace 95% of cars with public transports and bicycles, and then the 5% remaining can be EVs if you want. The reality of EVs is they shift the carbon footprint from driving to manufacturing, and the emission from local to the power plants (depending on the production means where you live), but the total reduction is not nearly enough.

Also, many developed countries tout EVs as "AMAZING" for the environment. Meanwhile that is solely because none of the lithium mining and processing occurs in their nice countries. While they get their nice "green" batteries, China and South American countries destroy their environment strip mining and processing lithium ore. That shit is TERRIBLE for the environment, and there is no economic incentive to clean up the process. The news, media, politicians, CEOs, etc. never speak about this because it paints the reality of the picture. You're shifting the carbon footprint to something else, not really even reducing it.
I actually am very interested in the new solid state batteries Toyota is talking about. Using polymer based batteries can allow for longer lasting, less impactful energy storage to help make electric/H-fuel cell cars genuinely green/a great step from combustion vehicles
Even if EV's did reduce the world's carbon footprint, it still would not have that big an effect overall
- One step at a time, I guess.
- To me it seems that governments insentivizing for EVs and photo-voltaic purchases, is plain and simple green washing. It is pushing the responsibility on the shoulders of citizens (you should recycle, you should save water, you should produce your own green energy) instead of doing meaningful reforms and public investments that could have a real impact.
- Exactly. It will take a concerted effort by essentially everyone on the planet to drive ICEs less, eat less meat, air condition their home to less extreme temperatures, buy fewer electronic devices, and buy fewer products packaged in plastics in order to drive down carbon emissions.
- Heat pumps should be required for all new buildings. With 300-500% efficiency and no CO2 make it a no brainer. FYI: yes the heat AND cool. Yes they work at -15 C (some at -25 C)

I hate Musk with a white hot intensity but I want Tesla to succeed. I think it’s important to stop burning oil, and I think the traditional car industry would drop EV production like a hot potato if the Tesla threat went away. I drive a Ford PHEV and I have a short commute so I buy gas a couple times a year. It was the better option for me, but I want people to keep buying teslas. So, they’re not tools, they’re smart, good-looking, and wonderful dancers.

Meh... Tesla has done it's job pushing us to EVs. The big players all have an EV that's competative to superior than what Elon is offering.
It's a self sustaining cycle outside of Tesla now.
- Yep. Tesla can eat shit.
https://techcrunch.com/2020/10/16/elon-musks-las-vegas-loop-might-only-carry-a-fraction-of-the-passengers-it-promised/ food for thought? So Musk isn't the man who we thought he is. He doesn't really care about the environment as much as he pretends to. This guy is all fake!
- Yeah. Total phony and a very dangerous piece of shit. Believe me I hate rooting for his shitty car company but with electric cars at least there’s the possibility of running them from carbon free sources like wind and solar. I always thought the hyper loop was all hype no loop.
Electric cars / Tesla aren’t doing anything to save the environment. Their only purpose is to keep the car industry going a bit longer.
How is the energy produced that goes into the vehicles? What about the workers in the “we’ll coup who we like” countries which dig up the resources to build the batteries? What about all the resources to build the things? What happens to the cars after the battery is done?
We should instead be thinking about building a better world where we don’t need to rely on cars to go to meaningless and harmful jobs. Cities should be more hostile to cars in general, and build environments which are more pedestrian / bike / remote worker friendly.
- I get it, I do. In fact I’d say I agree wholeheartedly with your third paragraph. But I reject the idea that imperfect steps in the right direction aren’t worth taking. We can’t scrap the suburbs and create a walkable city overnight. It will take time and concerted effort. In the meantime I charge my car with sunshine. About 15 minutes worth is enough to get to work. You won’t convince me that that is not better than burning a quart of gasoline to achieve the same result.
- Never getting rid of personal transportation. People want to travel to see & do things that aren't going to be served by public transport.

I bought a Tesla because I wanted an electric car with certain features and all the other brands, sold thru dealerships, insisted in charging a 'low stock' fee of $6-$10k that I wasn't willing to pay, even though I prefer some of the other options.

If that makes me a tool.. well, ok I guess. I'll be in the shed if you need me

One of the reasons I bought my Model Y is the Supercharger network. Last winter my wife an I did a road trip vacation up & down the east coast and we never had a single issue with charging.
I’m thrilled to see all the other auto manufacturers that have announced support for Teslas NACS adapter. Whenever I’m in the market for my next EV I’ll gladly look at all those options that weren’t available a couple years ago.
- Exactly this. I expect to keep my Model Y around for a long time, but I'm excited about how much more developed the EV industry will be when it's time for me to buy my next car. More competition is always a good thing, and I'm hoping the new players in the EV space will either produce a better product than Tesla, or force Tesla to iron out more kinks in their products to stay competitive.
Did you know about the subscription fee for the live traffic, no navigation after 8 years, no CarPlay/android auto, extra for the wall charger, and cheap plastic box interior look before buying it though?
- Yes, as someone who also purchased one. Premium connectivity is $10/mo or $100/yr and it does a lot more than give you access to live traffic. You can also use it to watch Netflix and Youtube, stream music, and straight up browse the web from the car's screen. If you don't want to pay for it you can hotspot the car to your phone.
  I ordered when the wall charger was still included so I still got one.
  I have no complaints about the interior, and anyone who was conscious during the test drive certainly knows what the interior looks like before buying one.
- I've been running for just about a year without the Premium Connectivity subscription.
  Did you know about the subscription fee for the live traffic,
  There's no fee for traffic aware route planning. The only thing the subscription fee gives you for traffic is the colored lines (red, yellow, green) on the screen when you look at it indicating traffic density. If you're using navigation without the subscription, the routing takes you to exactly the same place on using the exact same roads while taking traffic density into account as the subscription does, just no colored lines.
  no CarPlay/android auto,
  You can use Carplay and Android Auto on your Tesla screen via third party apps. Here is a video of it is running on a Model 3 The app I use cost $5 to enable Android Auto on the Tesla.
  extra for the wall charger
  My wall charger came with the car.
  no navigation after 8 years,
  I guess I'll use Android Auto then.
  Sorry to kill your rant points.

from what I've seen about Tesla, reliability is a factor. Here's a quote from Which, a good place for reviews in the UK: "Tesla cars garner a lot of hype for their innovations, but reliability isn’t one of their strengths, according to our annual survey of owners. In our latest reliability survey, the Tesla Model 3 performed well in a number of areas. However, the fact that 28% of owners experienced at least one fault (well above the average) consigns the Model 3 to a three-star score for reliability."

Isn't reliability kind of... the top factor you need in a car?

As someone who does not own a Tesla due to a crippling, chronic case of nomoneyitis, a Tesla has been my dream car for a while. That is to say, it was, because after watching more than a few Technology Connections videos @ YouTube, Hyundai’s EV has me looking like that distracted boyfriend meme.

It looks even cooler than a Tesla to me, and the features seem better too.

I remember seeing somewhere that Toyota has an EV in the works that can go hours on 10 minutes of charging.
Now this was just the title of a post on reddit, but if it's true, Tesla should be terrified.
- By around 2030. It was a puff piece that went viral because the headline and manufacturer.

That's why I still want my Nissan Leaf instead of a Tesla

I recently got a used low-mileage Nissan Leaf and it's been fantastic! I didn't realize it was my dream car til I had it
- I very recently lost my 11-bar gen1 leaf when I got rear-ended. It had 110k km on it and I really loved it. Once insurance made me the boy-out offer I Immediately went to check out the newer leaf expecting more of what I lost, and I'm sorry to say that I really really didn't like the gen2 leaf. It was gutless and felt like the suspension was made of marshmallows.... Yes it was bigger, but it lost all the magic the first gen had and became a floaty family sedan that happened to be electric.
  I oped for a VW e-golf instead and it's been amazing!!

i'm just waiting for a reasonably priced e-car capable of towing an RV trailer a reasonable distance to hit the second hand market.

i don't really care which billionaire cunt the original owner gave their money to.

it probs wont be a tesla though. they have a poor record on right to repair which is pretty important on the second hand market

Right that's where the shoe drops for me as well, the newest/nicest car I ever bought still had 60k km on it, and was reasonably priced (<20k€).
I can't really see myself buying anything more expensive than that, my other car is a 2003 Kangoo I use for my work I got for 2000€...
Feels like it'll still be a while before you can get this kind of second hand value deals with electrics.
Me too, I have to buy a new car soon and feel let down by the industry. Get your act together please and give me a 25k ev that can tow 2k lbs 100 miles.
We were supposed to have hover cars by now :(

I've received numerous reports on this post now, and I'm doing my best to leave it up. Please refrain from personally insulting people here (i.e. the post title and update). Still leaving it up for now.

The problem is the entire post is intentionally argumentative. Unpopular opinions aren't calling other people assholes to get some rage bait.
Don't give in to the Tesla stans, mod. Don't do it.
- Pretty sure rule 2 is the only reason the mod is considering it. You could just be a little less... insulting? Then you'd be safe

You have a problem with Tesla's boss, not with Tesla.

Outside of Musk the reported build quality issues put me off owning one. That and the design looks dated now.
- Fair enough. At least this has something to do with the brand and their product.

Hey, you do you man. If you solely base your opinion of people based on what car they drive I am not going to convince you otherwise. I mostly presume this is meant as a trigger post to drive engagement, in which you succeeded.

With that said, I have a model 3 and I'm pretty happy with the car and how Tesla have been treating me. The supercharger network is fantastic for long travel. I don't agree with Musk on most things and maybe my next car won't be a Tesla. It's always a pros/cons weighing on what features you value most atm.

I don't care . Alls car are garbage . Be dependent to them suck .

I don't know a ton of Tesla owners, but the ones I do know aren't "Tesla Bros" by any stretch. Half of them didn't even know who Elon was and once I explained the response was "oh that guy owns Tesla? I didn't know that".

I think the average population just isn't that in the loop sadly.

Did you read the news today? Did you go on reddit or lemmy? Congratulations. You're actually more informed than 99% of humanity.

Counterpoint: Anyone who bought a combustion engine car in the past few years is a tool.

See how that works?

I mean, those can both be true. You can buy an electric car without buying a Tesla.
On the other hand, someone buying a used minivan because it's what they can afford should not be tarred with the same brush as someone buying a brand new Tesla because they're an Elon Musk fanboy.
- A lot of people bought their teslas before Elon started flipping out. Tesla has also been lowering prices in many markets recently. I’m not going to razz someone for buying a decently priced electric car with a good range. Hopefully Elon gets kicked off the board at some point so the people that actually do the work at Tesla can get back to business.
- Also, for those of us who live in cities and have street parking only, not having a reliable place to charge is kind of a deal breaker. I’d love a cheap reliable EV. I think it’s an absolute shame, and a missed opportunity that the new Prius wasn’t an EV, but even if it were I don’t think I could buy one without having somewhere to charge it.
I bought a new car a few months ago and really, really wanted to buy an EV. Problem is, I'm going to retire in a little over a year and told my wife she could pick where we move to. I don't know where that's going to be, or what the infrastructure in the area will be like. Also it's very likely we'll be taking a lot of driving trips, and reports from my friends who have EVs about cross country trips seem annoying to me - having to plan around where chargers are.
I ended up getting a Hyundai sonata hybrid, and I'm very happy with it. It's a good-sized sedan, but I get between 40 and 50 MPG, which is more than double was I was getting in my prior car. I'm pretty sure my next car (my wife's next car, really) will be an EV assuming we move before we buy it.

Teslas build quality has been hit or miss since they came on the market.

I will always respect them for showing people that electric cars can be viable and fun. But nowadays, I would never bring myself to buy one knowing that some of the profit is going towards that fucking imbicile who owns twitter.

While I'm not looking to get a new car rn. Down the road I'd like to consider something like a Toyota BZ4X. The first gen has a few issues that need to be ironed out. But a few years from now, I reckon itl be a great option

That or something like it from Honda. Those two brands are who I trust most in terms of reliablity and build quality if I'm going to make an investment in a new kind of car, I want it to be them.

Hyundai and Toyota aren't investing in EVs like they should. Kia and Hyundai are way ahead. The Hyundai Ioniq 5 is what the BZ4X hopes it will be in 4 years. The Hyundai has a more advanced battery and better overall performance, and it looks better.
Did they do that though? Did they show they were viable and fun? Or is Elon Musk just better at social media than General Motors?
Kias are good, best BMS according to me

I actually would have wanted to get a Tesla and had been eyeing them for a bit when I knew relatively little about Musk. Since he showed the world what a toolshed he was and can't stop opening his stupid mouth... I won't do anything to support Musk at all, I'll never buy a Tesla with him around. I'd still want to go all electric, but just waiting for something relatively affordable and dependable to present itself.

I don't purchase things or make investments based on CEOs. The history of automaker CEOs is quite ugly. I also use Amazon, and Bezos is also a tremendously evil "tool." Just because a CEO is dumb enough to be loud-stupid in ways that are accessible to the public doesn't make them worse/better in my eyes.

Tesla as a company has great engineers, they've basically built a tremendous drivetrain on an incredible car frame, and they don't care at all about the interior fit and finish. Emphasizing Elon over the engineers that put those cars together is a disservice to the hard work of the people actually doing the work.

Teslas are some of the safest cars on the road. They're an engineers car: all the work is in the parts you can't see. You can hate Elon all you want, but if their safety record continues to be as stellar as it has been, I'll probably buy a Model Y in the next couple of years. Not because I love or hate Elon--he doesn't enter into the equation when I'm thinking about the safety of my family--but because the engineers at Tesla have designed a very safe electric car.

If all you look at are the loudest articles, the most repugnant tweets, have at. I'm looking for a car that, per mile, provides safe transportation. When it comes to electric cars (or any car, really), Tesla has consistently been at the top.

Engineer here. I wouldn't buy a Tesla. They're safe cars (outside of the self driving tech) but their reliability is awful. I'm not in the market for a new car right now but I expect by the time I am, Tesla will likely no longer be the dominant player in the EV market. I appreciate the engineering that went into making them so safe and performant, but every aspect of them that Elon touches is awful, and they've arguably already squandered their headstart in the electric car space.
- Makes a lot of sense. I don't think I would put my life in the hands of a company whose culture was built heavily on a mantra of "move fast & break things." That motto gets us really sweet tech, sure, but as soon as it matures to the point that lives depend on it, it's better to have it built by someone who takes making it safe & enduring seriously. And Elon, by many accounts, is a manchild in his fifties who still thinks 420 and fart jokes are funny, and shoves that onto his customers.
  I myself am not in the market for any car right now, my bicycle is likely to last me a few more decades and the trains & busses, although a little pricey in my area, are still reliable enough that I can depend on them for my regular needs. Though someone in my family is looking to get an EV in the somewhat nearby future (and solar cells on their roof), so that's something to consider...
- Why do you consider them to be unreliable? I ask because I've heard that complaint before, but I can't find any data that backs up their unreliability.
  My wife has had a Model 3 for almost four years now, she drives for work (and pleasure) and is at 112K miles, and she hasn't even needed to change the brakes. She's had the air filters replaced once a couple years ago, and that's it. Other than tire rotation/change, it's just been... a car. We don't even think about it, but I know that's just one case, so I'm always interested to read more.
  I know they're not going to be the predominant EV going forward, so if there's data on reliability, I would be interested. I'm just less inclined to buy an EV from a company that hasn't been making them as long, but I'm open to changing my opinion for sure.
Yeahhhhhhhh if everyone bought vehicles based on CEOs/owners of companies, Volkswagen would uh, be rather dead at this point. Or have a very dedicated niche.
And Ford, as well. Henry Ford was not exactly a paragon of virtue.
- Sure, but at the same time they aren't shouting from the rooftops that they're idiots and making clowns out of themselves at the same level as Elon has been...
- Reliability and safety are not the same thing.

Honestly the car industry as a whole is whack, not just Tesla.

Most manufacturers would screw over their customers as well as the planet if it means a bigger profit.

"Fuck you for trying to buy a car that you might enjoy, now get back to the shitty car companies who have a monopoly on the automotive business."

Like seriously, Hate Elon all you want, but no we haven't known "for years" and you claims on "safety items" seems dubious at best. But more importantly people wanted a specific car. If you buy it specifically because of Elon, ok, but most people just want the best car, and pretending the automotive industry isn't filled with the absolute worst of humanity (Far worse than Elon, just not public facing enough)... like you're kidding yourself bud.

If you’ve bought a Tesla in the last five or so years, you’re a damn goober in my eyes. That’s my hot take, prepared for being called poor and other sodium, tear filled comments from fools whose opinions don’t matter.

Here's my hot take, I really don't give a shit what you think, and I'm saying this as a non-Tesla owner. It's not about you being poor, or any other salty, you're a pure asshole (let me guess BMW driver). You belittle others who "opinions don't matter" but I'm really struggling why does anyone care what you think at that rate?

And no this being "Unpopular" isn't good enough this is just a shitty argument. This is OP just being argumentative and insulting.

Hell the "Elaine" joke should offend those who propose to care about gendered insults, but I suppose that will be accepted because "Bad man deserved it" or something. Do the same to Elliot Page, and you'd be crucified though.

It’s really interesting how musk has completely trashed his reputation over the past idk 3 years or so. I wonder if he’ll eventually be kicked out of Tesla. The brand has gone from aspirational to a sort of weird tech-bro joke. The huge advantage Tesla still has is in their charging network which is still miles better than anything else, unless you live in norway. With other pretty major manufacturers signing on to support the Tesla Charing standard (cockily named NACS) we’ll see where the industry ends up. Wonder if Tesla is thinking of transitioning from a car manufacturer to a charger enjoyer.

Op sounds like a douche tho.

I love my Leaf. Only 129 miles for range and can take longer than 12 hours to charge in my garage but not having bought gas for almost 5 years has been great and it's a joy to drive an electric car. I compared the Leaf to the Tesla Model 3 at the time and could find no reasons that the Leaf wasn't a better use of my money. Tesla electric cars seem like more of a status symbol than an environmental or economic decision in today's EV market.

I've never once bought or not bought a product because of who the CEO is. I'm definitely not going to start now.

All CEOs are assholes, so to the people who say not to buy just because of a CEO are just reactionary fools.
Elon is also CEO is SpaceX, but SpaceX is by far the biggest disruptor to commercial space that has ever existed. Granted its success is all thanks to SpaceX President Gwen Shotwell, and not Elon.
- Agreed! It amuses me that Elon gets all the credit/criticism when he's basically the spokesperson and the lightning rod for all of his companies.
Are you still on reddit ?
- No

Musk has lost a lot of respect over the years and that's continuing in the same trajectory. I always sensed he wasn't being honest and I guess he kind of is being more himself.

Tesla is way over priced than what it's actually worth to build the vehicles, this is based on what they've said themselves. The fact is it's in so much demand that as usual when that happens the price increases. Other companies just need to make the jump to EV vehicles for Tesla's to need to lower prices or improve even more, but your post reeks of some other reasoning to why you're posting this.

It's been said a million times, but being overpriced and insisting on totally unnecessary (and downright harmful to the EV industry) proprietary connectors makes them the Apple of cars.
The parallels are stunning. They need to be stifled before anything they do in this sphere seems like a good idea.

Tesla's are very dangerous: https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/06/10/tesla-autopilot-crashes-elon-musk/

Don't put your life and the life of those around you at risk by driving a Tesla

That first example is just pure stupidity on the driver - crashes when the "autopilot" makes a sudden, unexpected movement are clearly the automations fault, but seeing that your car isn't slowing down when approaching a school bus and just "waiting to see what happens" is why that person should never be able to drive ever again.
- The problem is Tesla's marketing.
  For years Elon said "The car drives itself, you don't need a driver". That is why Tesla drivers do such stupid things.

The title is misleading, the problems happen in all AutoPilot equipped Teslas.
Shocking Leaked Tesla Documents Hint at Cybertruck Problems

agreed, but people still support amazon & apple like they're the next coming of christ. there are no ethical corporations under capitalism

There is no ethical "consumption" under capitalism correct. That being said, you still try to avoid giving white supremacists and Nazi sympathizers money.
Used to work for a company you names and even as a low level guy it was so obvious how immoral they were. Oh, your device is shocking your ears?
Checks "phrasing instructions"
"Oh, it's not your device that's doing that, you must have a health issues and should see a doctor now, that's crazy! No I don't know why it only happens when you have the device held to your ear and the shock us going through your ear!"
"No I don't know why your house burned down, it couldn't possibly be because the latest software update was to make your device obsolete by ruining the battery life which caused instability and made it explode hence burning down your home in an attempt to force you to upgrade to our latest piece of shit product because we made the first one so well that it never would've broken meaning no one will buy our new ones that IF you're lucky will last a year conveniently just in time for our newer even less stable piece of SHIT brick to drop!"

get a jeep tire rotation at dealer service and they add unscheduled brake maintenance not covered under warranty. $900. Tesla checked wear in my driveway and said it wasn't needed. $0.00

I opted for a Chevy Bolt instead of a Tesla, primarily because of the cost being lower. Secondarily it was because Musk is a dipshit.

I don't think this is an unpopular opinion. Politics aside, you have to be ignorant to make this purchase. A little research will show you this is not the most reliable of product.

I respect your opinion and I hate pretty much everything that Musk says and does... but I love my car. The other options on the market are not as good at this point. Maybe soon they will be, and I'll look at them again next time I buy.

Porsche's Taycan is $10k more than the Model S and superior in pretty much every aspect other than range. And even then it has a 250-300 mile range.
Not to mention it handles better, is based on a well proven frame, has better safety ratings, it's the better car in all bit range and charger availability (and Porsche has committed to setting up chargers in every multiple cities across America)
And where Porsche chargers do exist: they're faster than the Tesla Superchargers. So.... idk what's this "are not as good" to you? What metric are you using to determine this? Until you articulate what metric you are judging the car from any discussion further than this is pointless.
Edit: And I've owned both cars. The Taycan is far better on road in my experience in Los Angeles, and I'll be able to tell you how it fares on a cross country trip soon.
My Tesla was all but forgotten after I got the Taycan.
- Model S and X are the most expensive Tesla models. Maybe they’re talking about the 3 and Y. Also chargers and range are some of the most important parts of an electric car.
I have a BMW i4 m50, and its so much better than a model S imo. Not even close.

We’ve known for years that the owner is a lying, creepy, out of touch dipshit and that it’s a very flawed car and the company will cut costs to save money on safety items, every time.

Do know you know anything about the companies you buy from every day? Do you know the CEOs of all the food companies, the phone companies, the car companies, the apps you use, the coffee you drink, the clothes you wear? Most of them are just as bad or worse. The media likes shitting on Elon Musk so you hear most of the bad shit about him. If you think Musk is even close to being the worst CEO, you are grossly misinformed.

If your bar for not buying from a company is that the owner is a dipshit and the products are flawed, I hope you're ready to start a commune in the woods and become a subsistence farmer.

Ah, the good old "You have one valid point and criticise one thing people do, but you yourself don't live the absolute perfect life without any flaws or bad things, so your point isn't valid and I won't listen".
I usually only see this when people criticise any behaviour which is bad for the climate.
- so your point isn’t valid and I won’t listen
  You were so quick to put my comment into one of your predefined "wrong opinion on the internet" category that you've misread or misinterpreted it. Nowhere did I say the point wasn't valid. I think it's great to be mindful of one's purchases. I just pointed out that the logic should be applied consistently. Everyone hates Elon Musk so much that many of them are forgetting how bad the rest of the corporate world is, and consequently is letting them off the hook far too easily.
  There is a difference between "other companies do this, so your criticism of Tesla isn't valid" and "other companies do this, so you should criticize them as well as Tesla". My position is the latter.
I agree with your premise. However I think that comparing Tesla and Musk to, say, the CEO of the company where you buy you coffee or clothes is a false equivalence.
The reasons I think OPs point is a bit more valid in the case of Tesla:
A vehicle is the second highest value purchase most people will make in their lives after a house. It deserves extra scrutiny
Musk has shown a willingness to do things with his companies that are either out of spite, for his own amusement, or are otherwise wildly against his companies' best interest. There are lots of CEOs who are shitbags, but most are actually trying to do what's best for their companies' bottom line.
- I think you're right about extra scrutiny being appropriate for more valuable purchases. However, you also have to consider the fact that most people buy a car every 8-10 years or so. When you compare the money spent on one car, versus money spent on 8 years of food, I think the gap is smaller than you might expect.
  To the second point, yes, I think Musk is extremely petty. It's very grating and seems very obnoxious, but I don't think it necessarily follows that being spiteful is going to be worse overall for society than doing what's best for a company's "bottom line". If you look at a company like Nestle, everything they do is for their bottom line, and they're one of the most evil entities on the planet. Kind of the whole problem with large corporations today is precisely that their "bottom line" is in direct conflict with what's best for everyone else.
Implying that people actually don't do this level of research is naive. Lots of people are conscientious about what companies they purchase from. Lots of people do exactly this level of research.
- You don't even have to do research with some companies because you gotta live under a rock to not have heard about their scummy CEOs.
- You don't even have to do research with some companies because you gotta live under a rock to not hear about their scummy CEOs.
Imagine living in a capitalist society and not paying attention to what you purchase. Might as well be cattle on a feed lot.

Although I do believe Elon has been acting like a fucking maniac for the past few years, I would still buy a Tesla if I had the money for it. There's absolutely no other electric vehicle on the market with so much tech and so much power for so little money.

Quality? For sure others are better in this regard. But just pure fun and power? No other even comes close, and the ones that do (Porsche Taycan, etc) are much more expensive to buy AND maintain.

There's a reason Tesla model 3 is the best selling electric vehicle in the WORLD. Shit's good yo.

We have to know how to separate Elon, the character from the products and services his company provides. (except Twitter, it's gonna burn to the ground.)

He's always been a maniac. People just started noticing after the Thailand cave incident.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-FGwDDc-s8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DopFo1rjAr4
There’s absolutely no other electric vehicle on the market with so much tech and so much power for so little money.
That's just blatantly false. There are a lot of other options out there that are at least comparable, if not outright better, than the Tesla models.
You would buy "the best tech" with "little money" on costs of quality, longivity and safety.
Just look at the control-arm problems and the way they "fix" it. Its disturbing.
Please never get trapped.
We have to know how to separate Elon
My principles don't allow for funneling money towards people who I believe will use it to make the world a shittier place.
- You must live your whole life buying from only neighboring farms and individual creators, right?
  I am curious which farm produced the smartphone and/or computer you’re using to browse this site?
- Do you actually think the tech and gadgets you use, the clothes you wear, etc, are all made/created from some wholesome benefactor? The products we use are the result of abusing third world/developing nations, including child labor. What a hypocrite.

I have never liked them, always thought they looked ugly as shit. And Musk made me hate them even more once he showed his true colors.

Tesla is an innovation. Without it carmakers would still be pushing us petrol suv down our throat. Tesla basically push forward the ev initiative, making ev cool. And the early adopters, i respect them for making ev cool.

Tesla is like iphone and steve jobs in the phone world.

No. You've got it wrong. Hur, dur, Musk bad so Tesla bad.
Tesla didn't make EVs cool. People just had a hard-on for 2012 Elon Musk, the "real life Tony Stark". People bought whatever he was selling because he was a disruptor and a memelord.

I think the biggest issue...well maybe issue isn't the right word, but it's easy for people to go "tesla is the best car I've ever known" but it is only part of the story. It's easy to love the idea of an electric car, I'm honestly interested in getting one for my next vehicle. I just want to know how many people that love tesla have owned any other electric vehicles. And of those that have, I'd love their opinions of both.

This is going to be what Lemmy is for a while, isn't it

Teslas have some serious issues and shortcomings. And I say that as an owner. FSD is a mess and I don't trust it. The model 3 has some very opinionated design choices. I don't like how it's frameless. The interior is nowhere near as nice as cars in the same price range. There's only 2 usb ports and you need to use one of them for dashcam storage. Maintenance is a pain in the ass to DIY. They remove key features over OTA updates(they took away radar sensors for parking in older model 3s).

However, if you're in the market for a used EV under 30k, you've only got basically 3 options: a rwd model 3, a leaf, or a bolt. The model 3 is the only one of those that has fast charging and can be taken on any sort of longer road trip. And they're cheap to charge at home. And even if you're shopping new, I'm fairly sure the base model 3 is the cheapest EV on the market if you qualify for the full tax credit.

Road tripping in a bolt is... bad.
Can't beat the price though, and unlike a Tesla it's a real car, with real buttons and real spare parts.

The best part of Tesla is the ability to purchase online without needing a dealer network. This is what I want other companies to copy.

For real. I shopped around every single EV on the market from the Bolt EV to the Cadillac Lyric. Every dealer wanted to gouge me.
Then I finally gave in and test drove a model 3. It was a generation better than anything else I had driven and it was cheaper. Sold. The charger network also helped to push me over the edge.
- Yeah, I just can't get rid of the coment in my head that driving a Tesla is like driving a printer.

I have a Model Y since nearly a year now and it's overall the best car I have ever owned. Drawbacks? So far no. QA issues? No. Overall quality is actually on par with a similarly priced German car, if you ask me. The rear bumper? Still attached.

At the same time Tesla is the only car company where people make a direct connection between the car and the CEO. Couldn't care less about Elmo.

At the same time Tesla is the only car company where people make a direct connection between the car and the CEO.
No other CEO sends me unwanted notifications when they tweet.
Not really, Tesla was presented very much like Apple and to a lesser extent Microsoft where the persona of the "genius innovative CEO" was as or sometimes more important than the product.
You haven't personally NOTICED any QA issues and the rear bumper is still attached after less than a year? Never mind then, must be the best built car ever! 🤦

Here's another unpopular opinion:

People blinded by the hatred towards Elon (or any other person) can't think straight and their opinions on related subjects aren't to be taken seriously

I hate obscenely rich guy A, you should be buying from obscenely rich guy B instead!
Do you think people just hate the guy for fun? This isn't team sports, he's a disliked figure for many legitimate reasons, whether you agree with them or not.
- Some people definitely hate him for "fun". I'm in no way denying there isn't legitimate reasons to be opposed to him but these people struggle hard when having to state those reasons.
  Hating Elon in trendy and that's undeniable.

I own a Model Y, don't give a fuck what Elon does or says. I own a Ford too and couldn't tell you who the hell the CEO of Ford is. Their personal opinions have fuck-all to do with the product, in my opinion. I test drove one, loved everything about the car, the charging network is objectively better, and I'm a big fan of self driving so that's a bonus. I'm a little over a year into ownership and there's absolutely no complaints I have about the car, it's been a great experience.

Now the question is, why do you have such strong opinions about what cars other people buy? I've had a great experience with my Tesla and don't know of any better way I could've spent my money on a vehicle.

I get you, man. I like my Volvo but I hate Swedish people! When my hate for the Swedes starts to boil up inside me and I start to grip that wheel hard, I just think of my car's strong but flexible chassis, collision detection, and understated yet elegant interior finishing and it calms me down.
- Lucky for you Volvo is an 82% Chinese company now.
The built quality is shit, you got to give him that
People love to hate Teslas, as seen from this post. My only complaint with mine is that there's a good chunk of the population that translates their hatred for Teslas into unsafe and aggressive driving. It's like, "Yes I get that you're far right and hate EVs / far left and hate Elon, but can I please merge onto the highway? My kids are in the car."
- It’s just like android vs iPhone wars. I don’t understand how some folks get so hung up on what other people are doing. Don’t like it? Buy something else. Seems a petty reason to be calling people names.

I bought a Hyundai Kona Electric at the start of the year and couldn’t be happier

Embarrassed for people who buy them nowadays.. There are so many better EV out there lmao

Not everyone lives their entire life in a big city.
I live in a walkable neighbourhood in a medium sized town in Estonia and barely drive on weekdays when the weather is nice, but when I want to get out of town, I'm still going to use my car fairly often because it'd be prohibitively expensive for the government to have trains available for every route I need to take and buses suck.
Sooo...100% of future transportation should be done by train or bus? Gonna build an express line out to grannie's house in the woods of rural upstate LargePlace? Maybe with a few local stops at some hiking trailheads? Can't forget to add a direct line from there to the closest grocery store two towns away, or maybe granny can just hop on the train to CenterTown and take the connecting bus over to Nowhere'sVille, and grab another train from there. God forbid she wants to visit Aunt Sue in Isolated Harbour. Or maybe we should just seize both their properties and relocate them to Dense Village, which was specifically designed to be public-transit friendly.
Yeah trains are awesome, and we should utilize them more (especially in the US). But public transit is not the solution to all long-distance travel. So why flat-out reject a theoretical improvement, on the basis that it's not a literally perfect solution?
- Basically these people's opinions are that suburban and rural areas shouldn't exist. The boom of suburbia over the last 50 years is because of cars and they are reliant and built around the existence of cars.

I can easily tell the difference between a 2013 vs 2023 Toyota Camry.

I literally can't tell the difference between a 2013 and 2023 Model S.

That's the real problem.

This comment has been up for two minutes and has been reported twice. I'm leaving it up as to give you the same leeway as OP using the insult "tool" and removing your comment would basically result in me removing the post as a whole, however, you've directed it at him, whereas OP was a broad statement, and everyone just calm down please
Edit - If you're wondering why these comments are now removed, it's because the user edited both of them to add further insults after the warning

And they’re not particularly well built; how many of these do you think will be on the road 20 years from now?

These two are not mutually exclusive. They're not well built, but they also have rediculously low failure rates. So they may have a lot more rattles, but I'd be surprised if most of the Teslas on the road today, don't last until they're at least 12, which is the average age of a car in America IIRC.

I don't have a tesla, so I don't have any reason to defend them.

But elon is not any different from any other automotive ceo. Wolkswagen, bmw, stellantis (FCA) and so on are actually much worse. They are cheaters, corrupted, most of them spent decades brabing governments to boycott public transportation and EVs.

Elon is bad, but he is probably the least bad of the automotive industry. Which gives you an idea on how much rotten is the automotive industry

We in Michigan are just used to it because it's been that way for years. It's The Detroit Way.

In my country it's either Tesla or GWM (the Chinese brand). Both have their problems.

Tesla are objectively inferior to established OEM in many ways. The build quality is awful, refinement is poor. The main advantage Tesla have is their system architecture. Since they were an electric car company from the outset, they don't have the problem of legacy systems and tooling to constrain their design solutions. This manifests as best in class efficiency, ability to remotely reprogram the control systems and surveil vehicle data. On the other hand, it takes a very long time indeed to solve the many problems of making a car reliable and high quality. They just haven't been around long enough to reach the level of OEM that have been doing this for a century. Tesla is mostly an exercise in slick marketing and it seems to be working, for now.

Don't really understand the energy spent on this matter. Just vote with your wallet. Don't like Tesla? Awesome. Don't buy one. Like them? Go ahead.

People are allowed to like and dislike things and not everything is run on a manichean paradigm of extreme hyperbole where things are absolute shit or the best thing that's ever happened.

A Tesla seems, objectively, like an okay car that's fun but usually comes with drawbacks and QA issues. Some will be more enthused by the latest gadget. Some wont.

Then after that, Musk as a public figure, the bro hype, stupid dodgecoin memes, etc... All of that is just noise.

Not only that, but posts and topics like this one actually just end up reinforcing Tesla whether they want to or not. It’s one more instance of the word “Tesla” being used, people start engaging on something related to Teslas, and some might start looking up facts or things related to Tesla… in the end, the hate just ends up being absorbed as more traffic and user engagement in relation to Tesla.
OP, you can also stand to be less of a douche who’s lowkey trying to instigate a flame war. This reads less like “I am against Teslas” and more “I want to start a pissing contest on the internet.”

this would be a popular opinion on this site

No half measures. !fuckcars@lemmy.world

Fuck cars is like libertarianism. It sounds great at first until you actually really think about it
- Full of people who live in big cities and/or small countries. The US is mostly very spread out and sparsely populated. Getting rid of cars just isn't feasible.

I’m pretty sure I remember seeing something about how Musk had very little to do with Tesla.

Elaine

🙄

When Elon realizes retirement age for women is lower than for men, he will transition, and that will be his new name. The internet will implode at that point
- Go back to Reddit.
  Really, you belong there.

Wow, spoken like an absolute tool.

I think they could have their place, just not under wonton capitalism with no regard for the environment
- I could stand for a bit more wonton capitalism. They make tasty soup!
  Or did you mean "wanton"?

I'm just over here sittin' in my lil 2006 civic hybrid, eatin' popcorn and celebrating 200k+ miles without so much as a loose screw.

I can at least congratulate you for finding the right forum. Fuck Elon regardless but I know a good deal when I see one and I can handle a little moral quandary. I like my '23 M3 and my TSLA gains. Enjoy your life getting pissed over the meaningless choices of others.

I would have totally considered a Tesla3 for my partner if not for all the reasons listed here.... Price wise they seemed like a good enough deal for a new Model3, but I couldn't get past the Musk factor, and the quality control issues - I would not trust my life in the hands of that company.

I just avpid the issue altogether and just use trains, buses and trams if I'm not walking or biking. Public transport is the only real future. And bikes.

Btw I lived in a rural town before living in a city so don't @ me about public transportation not being viable in rural places, once the cities are well served and built around public transportation that can be expanded to more rural places. The few places where it is genuinely impossible to viably use even a modest or limited public transportation network are inhabited by so few people that its impact from them using cars would be negligible.

In fact I'd say it's not so much what type of car you drive but rather how much you use your car, because electric cars are less polluting than combustion engine cars but they're still pretty polluting and come with all the issues cars come with. If you have alternatives to driving: use them; if there aren't but there could be: fight for those alternatives; if neither: use whatever car you have already for as long as you can before it destroys itself like your toilet after a night out eating 50kgs of mexican food like a slutty little boykisser, after that perhaps look into buying one of the alternatives listed here.

Thanks for coming to my TED talk

The public transport argument is just not feasible for most people though.
I live in a suburb of a city in the UK. For me to get to work I need to take two busses and a train which equates to around 2.5 hours of travel each way without delays. Alternatively I can drive to work in less than 40 minutes.
Public transport is only the future ifit becomes a realistic and reliable alternative. At the moment, that is simply not the case for the majority of people. And in my city the public transport has arguably gotten worse in the last decade.
Ofcourse this is location dependent. When I lived in London you couldn't have paid me to drive a car as the public transport was far easier to use.
Bring on the downvotes for speaking the truth
- Agreed and I'm a rural American who lives in a proverbial transit desert. Surrounded by multiple major cities with fully integrated public transit, so this whole idea behind "oh once the cities get it so will the rural areas" is total bullshit. Hell, I even live on a commuter train line and the fucking thing doesn't run on the weekends and only goes north to south, it doesn't connect to any major urban center to the east. So, if you have to work that way, you have to drive. There's no bus, no tram, no train, only massive stretches of interstates. Our state got a massive transportation grant and instead of begging the state to bring the commuter line to at least the next city over, the county had them build fucking park and rides - just giant parking lots in the middle of nowhere where you can, in theory, catch a bus that will take twice as long to get you to your destination than driving.
  I've attended the state's annual transportation public meetings every year for the last six years. They send a delegation to each county to discuss budgets and county needs. Every year. Every goddamn year our county begs the state to increase the commuter rail availability and every year they lie and say they're working on a plan then turn around and expand the highways and try to sell the local political apparatus on fucking toll roads.

If you buy any EV besides a Tesla you are a fool.

buying a car is not an endorsement of the manufacturers CEO
Tesla charging network is unbeatable (such as the fact that it works)
every other EV is first-gen and unproven. Tesla battery degradation is known because there are 10+ year old cars on the road with hundreds of thousands of miles. There is no significant loss of range in the normal lifespan of an automobile
Tesla quality sucks but so does pretty much every manufacturer
the price is the price of a Tesla. You know exactly what you will pay before stepping foot in a "dealership". There are no market adjustments and shady BS.
since they are an ev only manufacturer I trust their service center 1000x more than a dealership whose techs work 99% on ice vehicles.
Elon musk might be a dumbass but he isn't going to intentionally compromise the safety of Tesla vehicles. It is bad business sense if it will lead to recalls, safety concerns, loss of mind share, etc

My opinion will change in a few years when Ford/gm/Hyundai/Kia/vw get another generation under their belt. I certainly wouldn't want to buy an EV now that doesn't have a "Tesla" nacs connector now that pretty much everyone has announced they are adopting it.

I’ve had a model 3 for 5 years and of the more than 10 I’ve had in my old age, it is by far the best, safest, most reliable vehicle I have ever owned. I based my purchase on the vehicle, not the fucking CEO you nimrod. I will buy another in the future.

I hate Trump. Does that mean I should have stopped buying anything American for 4 years?

Are not Volvo and Tesla the car companies with the highest security rating? I thought both them companies do more security testing than they have too.

This all lives rent free in your head, wow.

Find something to keep you occupied

I’m not a musk fan and he’s really turned me off from the brand but as far as my car goes it’s great.

Source: Goober who bought one two years ago and has enjoyed it thoroughly.

Everyone i know who purchased these are disappointed after the honeymoon wears off and like the doors randomly open or fall off.

how many of these do you think will be on the road 20 years from now?

While I agree with the basic premise of your argument, this isn't the knock you think it is. The majority of passenger cars won't be on the road in 10 years, let alone 20. Between poorly designed cheap econo-cars, people who want the latest new thing, and people who abuse their car (insanely long commutes, deferring maintenance, etc), they just don't last that long on average. I rarely see a 2013 model or earlier let alone a 2003 or eariler.

The average age of registered cars is 12 years. And it keeps rising.
https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a43903366/average-car-age-12-years/
Me and my wife both have cars over 14 years old with 200k miles and they're just fine.

The smart thing to do is lease a Tesla so you can get your dick sucked at the party. Women love teslas.

Based
t. Non Tesla driver or Elon fanboy

I think you're living in an online Reddit bubble. I'm not an Elon fan at all, and most people in the real world don't drive cars based on their political affiliation.Lots of CEOs of major car companies are slimy and have been involved in scandals.

I bought my model 3 for $50k CAD after incentives and tax which is expensive but not an absurd price, and have had 0 problems with it after 2 years and it's an amazing car. I know about the quality control issues with some cars but the warranty is good. I'm pretty sure the oldest Teslas on the road are 13+ years old so I'm pretty happy I'll get to drive it for so long.

my favorite tesla fact is that the ass ends of the car are only held on with double sided tape and fall off cause they are so poorly designed that they fill with water when driving in the rain.

I'm not sure where you got this from? The rear bumper on the Model Y is held on with a couple bolts and industry-standard body clips. You can watch a disassembly video here:
https://youtu.be/BWmAlfzCtoc?t=515
- https://www.autoblog.com/2020/10/20/tesla-model-3-bumper-defect-warranty/
So you just repeat whatever you see online, no wonder propaganda works so well on people.
- First of all, its a fact. https://www.autoblog.com/2020/10/20/tesla-model-3-bumper-defect-warranty/
  Second of all, fuck off, Muskrat.

People should separate the quality of the products, produced by the workers, from the batshit insane politics and mindset of the owners. I have a Tesla, and I recognize Elon is a protofascist dick, but the CEOs of other companies are just better at maintaining their image, they're part of the same parasitic class that Elon is a part of.

I bought a Tesla for the power, infrastructure, etc. but I don't generally recommend Teslas. If you don't care about 0-60 time, and you can hold out until 2024/2025, lots of EVs will adopt the NACS standard and be able to use almost the entire supercharging network. Other vehicles will likely be better and/or cheaper.

Who cares man, this is rich people shit.

Find me an electric car with drive assist on local roads in all 50 states. Then also find me a car that has a Ryzen processor and web browser where I can load streaming NBA playoff games while I'm charging. And most importantly, find me an electric company with the charging network Tesla has, today, not in a few years when it's "opened up". Then get out of your mom's basement.

Yes Elon fucking sucks, so do all ceos. I bought a used Tesla and Ive had a great experience with it

So brave of you, posting such an "unpopular" opinion about Elon Musk on a site that hates Elon Musk. I pray you don't get downvoted so harshly.

Tesla and the people in it are great. It's being undermined by a brainless rich person that tries to act smart

Ummmm, if you are in the US, you don't have a damn clue what you speak of. Go do a roadtrip on non-teslas. Can it be done? Sure? But expect broken CCS1 stations all along the way. Expect that you will have to wait forever to charge. If you are replacing your ICE vehicle and need to travel outside of your local area, Tesla has been the only game in town. End of story.

Why do you think every major car company with significant electric vehicle sales is jumping to the Tesla connector? It is because the Tesla supercharger network is so much better than everything else.

Tesla isn't just their cars, it is their ecosystem. Tesla invested in a massive charging network, VW is next closest but CCS1 legit sucks. CCS2 would have been fine but the US in their infinite wisdom jumped on CCS1.

Now that companies are jumping on the tesla connector, I actually think we will see some real competition in short order which is good for everyone.

This. The only reason I have a tesla is the supercharger network. There is simply no argument for any other car brand if you are only considering full electric. I hate Elon as much as the next guy but that won't change my mind about buying a car from him. I'd be a real fuckin idiot if I made financial decisions to spite a billionaire who doesn't even know I exist and never will.
That said, once the Ford transition to NACS is complete in 2025(?) I'll definitely ditch Tesla. As a union worker myself I'd prefer to drive a union-built car, and as a bonus it would be nice to not have people assume I'm an Elon fan just because I drive a car made by a company he works at part-time.
- Elon is a giant fucking tool. But lets not act like the other billionaires or multi multi millionaire CEOs of the other companies aren't giant pieces of shit. They are. They are just smart enough to keep their mouth shut publicly.

Have you ever driven one? Probably not I'm guessing

I have. They're kind of fun and I would still never buy one. A Polaris Slingshot is kind of fun and I'd never buy one either.
You also don't need to have eaten a shit filled sandwich to know it's not a good sandwich.
- Well I can say the technology ive seen in them I haven't seen in any other car, ever. Being able to look at the car on your phone when its 100s of kms away, see all the cameras around it, have it begin recording if someone walks near it or a car drives near it while its parked.. I haven't driven any other electric but the acceleration is also something I have never experienced in a car either.

Tesla is one of the best-selling cars in America and in fact was the best-selling car last month. You can have your opinion if you want, but it's ultimately wrong.

Trust me nobody cares half as much as you do.

You’re right, this is an unpopular opinion.

I find it funny that

You care this much about what other people drive when it has nothing to do with safety.
Think people even think about Elon when they buy a Tesla.