Is Google Pixel actually good for privacy?
I hear many people say that the Google Pixel is good for privacy, but is it?
I'm asking this because I find it weird, of all the companies, Google having the most “privacy”.
Commenting from my GrapheneOS Pix6, I actively prefer GOS to stock, and get a sense of disdain or my soul sighing every time I pick up my stock rom Pix6 now.
I bought my girlfriend a Pixel 6A as birthday gift last year and whenever I use it I'm blown away by how smooth and fun everything feels on GOS. Every other Android I use feels so sluggish, blown up and hard to use in comparison
Hey, which app do you house to get emails? I don't think there is a thunderbird port for Android, is there?
Will I be able to use such an app with Google emails without play services being installed on the device?
Wouldn't say they're cheap though. Maybe compared to flagships, but def not to phones most people can afford.
I get a lot of use out of Google wallet. Can that be sandboxed on graphene?
Google wallet is one of the few apps that don't work on GrapheneOS.
Most banking apps actually do work
However, Android is more secure, as evidenced by higher exploit prices for Android than for iOS.
that could be attributed to market share.
Yeah. I thought it was weird, but the stock Pixel is very secure, and if you install Graphene OS, it is even more so. Additionally, Graphene OS sandboxes The Playstore Apps, and gives you much more control over what the Apps you install are allowed access to. You have to go way out of your way to make it less private than the stock OS, and you pretty much can't make it less secure than the stock OS.
You can get almost anything that works on the stock Pixel working on Graphene OS except for Google Wallet and the Android drive app. Banking Apps work, Google Apps work (but you might as well try to use alternatives).
I had an iphone for years, but after using Graphene OS for the past 3 months, I can honestly say I'll do everything I can to not go back.
GrapheneOS on a Pixel 7 is one of the best decisions I ever made. You can sandbox the shit out of all apps and granularly control the permissions in addition to outright cutting off network access to apps that would otherwise be doing background telemetry garbage all the time.
If you're terminally online and just can't imagine life without all the first party Google apps, you'll disagree with me. But otherwise it is a great decision. F-droid and Aurora Store are awesome. (You can still manually install and use stuff like the Google camera app, Maps and others. Just never sign in to first party G Apps, be careful with your permissions etc. and you'll retain 90% of the functionality while not having the privacy downsides.)
I've been using LineageOS+MicroG with very little google software (only maps) and it's been working great. Any reason I should switch to Graphene? I noticed the main dev seemed to have some disputes and interesting personality characteristics, so I was a bit hesitant to adopt. I also had an irrational "I wouldn't be surprised if 3 letter agencies are involved" vibe about Graphene, but nothing concrete.
Does the Gmail app work in grapheneOS?
Gmail will work fine, including push notifications, assuming you enable Google Play Services. Using either will of course come at the cost of privacy.
Yes it should although you may not get notifications of emails. I'd use ProtonMail or Tutanota instead anyway.
Yes, it is. I mean, GrapheneOS is the gold standard for privacy&security, but even stock Pixel is a good step up. Think of it like this: on stock Pixel, only Google is tracking you, not Google + Samsung, or Google + Xiaomi. Just Google. It's guaranteed to be a step up from all other Android phones, stock or not.
Wow the fact that this is considered good is depressing
Technically it is just better than the worst possible case, which is two companies or more spying on you instead of one that was already spying on you. It is still bad but better than the worst case.
Wait since when a monopoly is preferable to a duopoly? As far as I'm concerned if I can't have 0 companies to spy on me I'd rather have them all fight each others in the data space...
Install GrapheneOS on it and it will be. Remember, security and privacy are two different things. You can be very secure without being private, and you can be very private without being secure.
Google Pixels by default are pretty secure, but not private, at least not to Google.
I'd argue yes.
I see Google as a known unknown, where as various other Chinese phones are unknown unknowns.
I acknowledge I have western bias, but the propaganda, human rights violations and control of the CCP is well understood.
At the very least Pixel let's you flash an alternative OS.
Basically every Chinese phone has a great custom rom support
Graphene only supports Pixels officially because of how easily you can unlock the bootloader
And rootkits on the chips. If not now then when.
Xiaomi phones used to be good for custom ROMs, but now they try to stop you unlocking the bootloader by making you wait an unreasonable amount of time after first registering the device with them before you can unlock. Many of the other vendors are even worse.
So from that perspective, Pixel devices are not a terrible choice if you are going to flash a non-stock image.
Not the stock os. You need to flash something else and relock the bootloader to take advantage of the pixel
Google Pixel hardware is focused on providing a private relationship between the user (your data and behavioral patterns) and Google.
Depending on your threat model you can flash custom roms to enhance your privacy and security posture.
A lot of folks here seem to be of the "...just flash GrapheneOS and you're good..." crowd but it's not that simple and there are trade-offs that impact usability and user experience.
There are a lot of interesting projects out there to choose from. Best advice is to work-up your real world threat model and do your reasearch.
You may find Louis Rossman's experience with GrapheneOS relevant: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4To-F6W1NT0&t=1
Here's a few links to help get you started - there are many android projects. I am not affiliated nor am I explicitly endorsing any of these projects.
CalyxOS https://calyxos.org/
LineageOS https://lineageos.org/
HavocOS https://havoc-os.com/
ResurrectionRemix https://resurrectionremix.com/
DerpFest https://derpfest.org/
PixelExperience https://wiki.pixelexperience.org/
GrapheneOS https://grapheneos.org/
Yeah the developer is very dramatic, but the project itself is still amazing. He did step down from lead, but the dude is a genius programmer. I'm still very confident on having it on my phone. I was using CalyxOS before, which I really like, but the sandboxed play services were a really killer feature for me on GrapheneOS.
I would add iodéOS to that list
Then let each user choose what they like
It’s one of the better options.
For a start, even if you run it stock, it’s somewhat on par with the iPhone (depending who you ask). You’re trusting one company with your data, Google. You’re not trusting Google AND Samsung, or Google AND Huawai. It’s just Google. Plus Google does offer good security, so your data/device is pretty secure. In comparison to Samsungs Knox… while better than a lot of other Android security stuff, is kinda bad.
Though, the real privacy win for the Pixel, is it DOES allow you to modify it. You can remove Google’s version of Android, and change to Calyx or Graphine OS. Both of which are fantastic options, that allow you to really lock things down.
A part of that is due to the fact that you now only have one company to worry about collecting data, rather than both the manufacturer(think Samsung) and then Google too.
They also play the best with options like Grapheneos or Calyxos
Google claims to do some processing on their own tensor chip locally so it might reduce some data being sent to Google, but it doesn't limit them from tracking you. With Pixel, you are only being tracked by Google and not Samsung or other manufacturer
Not sure how I should feel about that. It's highly likely any party engaged in tracking activities will try to grab as much data as they can. So a non-Google device seems like it would be doing twice the amount of data collection.
But considering Google also controls the hardware design of the Pixel, it wouldn't surprise me if they have some additional tricks up their sleeve.
What we really need is a full open-source phone, including firmware. Maybe we'll get there one day.
Just install GrapheneOS. The only things that don't work on it are Google Pay and Android Auto.
Who the actual fuck said this to you? Google is one of the worst companies for privacy.
I mean i guess with a pixel, you're just being spied on by Google rather than Samsung + Google if you buy a samsung android, so in that sense, sorta? But saying a pixel is good for privacy in general is an absolutely ridiculous statement.
It's because you install another OS on it
I sorely miss the hardware features from my previous phone, like a notification LED, MicroSD card slot and headphone jack, but I can't go back to a phone where I can't re-lock my bootloader after installing a custom ROM like CalyxOS or GrapheneOS.
MAC address randomisation is pretty neat too.
I can’t go back to a phone where I can’t re-lock my bootloader after installing a custom ROM
Is this something that only certain models of phone are capable of doing? Or is it a new Android/hardware feature that only new phones have?
It requires a flashed rom with a valid (key signature? Crap, forget what it's called).
If you flash an unsigned kernel and try to boot lock, it'll brick.
I get from an absolute security perspective why this is deemed important, I just feel there's a bit too much focus on it, as if an unlocked bootloader is really that insecure. It would still take tremendous effort to get the encryption key for storage, so it's pretty effectively secure still.
It's specific to the bootloader of a given device. Most devices don't seem to support being locked with custom OS images using self signed keys.
like a notification LED, MicroSD card slot and headphone jack
Ah, another Galaxy S9?
An Asus Zenfone 6. Still ended up being a regrettable purchase for other reasons.
I LOVE GRAPHENEOS
Google Pixel has the most support for security, which relates to privacy. It does "phone home," but likely only to Google. Removing all the Google software and installing GrapheneOS further hardens the security and vastly improves the privacy by stopping the "phoning home."
Who says the google pixel is good for privacy? Google?
Pretty much everyone that knows about privacy focused phones. Ironic that google supplies the only way to avoid google. It will be a sad day when they lock android down.
Well it really depends. They definitely are one of the most secure devices.
With the stock ROM only Google gets your data. So it's better than for example a Samsung device where both Google and Samsung and maybe some other companies get your data
Then with GrapheneOS its the most secure and private device.
Makes sense. They do no evil.
pixels have the highest hardware security of all Android phones, which increases privacy potential. assuming you keep the stock os and default Google settings, though, it's about the same as any other.
Google also has good support for alternative OS'/Android forks, which is likely where that claim is leading to.
Pixels get verified boot and bootloader relocking for custom roms like grapheneos as well, so you can be sure your device isn't compromised even with a privacy respecting custom rom. I guess this is what most people refer to.. Oh, and Pixels are probably going to get security patches for the kernel as well as the vendor blobs unlike many other vendors..
Google One is the marketing people are probably referring to for privacy.
The pixel has the default function for DNS over HTTPS and their Google One offering has a VPN to "protect" your data. Both of those are sold as privacy measures.
I see a lot of responses here seem kinda out of touch with the actual functionality of the phone and what marketing pushes Google does.
That’s newspeak. Just like war is peace.
Its not pixel that is good for privacy... Its how you use OR not use it when required... For example, if I was manifesting, I would not bring it with me even with a custom ROM installed
You can install on it a lot of custom ROMs, including GrapheneOS and CalyxOS.
additionally you don't need to jump across several hops to flash custom roms on Pixel phones (or tablets)
it's easy as using a web browser
meanwhile custom roms on Xiaomi or Samsung are a huge pita to setup and require almost shady looking korean or chinese (windows) applications
About how Pixel is more private.. Pixel 'only' has Google's tracking; other manufacturers have their own tracking, on top/in addition to Google's tracking.
Installed GrapheneOS and adjusted my google settings to track everything they can, then I checked to see how much data that got collected, it is almost nothing.
This is gonna be a foolish and stupid question but how did you check how much data was being collected?