hassanmckusick @ hassanmckusick @lemmy.discothe.quest

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350

Joined

2 yr. ago

Nope, you can’t.

Maybe I'm explaining myself poorly, maybe you disagree. To clarify to anyone still reading I am not trying to absolve anyone of murder. Hamas did commit terrorism as defined in the dictionary.

But should the US be the entity in charge of making that distinction? Has the US ever used that designation inappropriately?

As an American I think Americans are particularly brainwashed about the term after the War on Terror and tying the word so heavily to racism. Terrorists are monsters but that rhetoric allowed us to dehumanize anyone accused of being a terrorist to horrific levels.

It is my belief that many of us realize we were manipulated by the rhetoric of War on Terror but find it a lot harder to look back before the War on Terror with the same clarity.

Hope you understand

Absolutely I do. And I hope you forgive me if I've said anything too ignorant.

I really am doing my best to inform myself. As soon as I saw your comment I skimmed a few articles about the events you listed and I could tell you put effort into it.

Honestly, this interaction renewed my faith in humanity a little. I'm going to try to put more effort in to make sure I'm not blaming anyone I shouldn't while defending my "side". Thanks :)

In spite of your bad faith arguments in this thread I do intend to look into this list.

It was not my intention although I can totally understand why it appears that way.

I plan to look into Arafat next. Followed by the events listed by E.B.Y.W. @ lemmy.word

If I moved into your house without permission and told you I'll bomb the shit out of you if you look at me funny you wouldn't accept it right away either.

It's not a double standard if I also say it's bad when my country does it.

But by any actual metric you know Israel kills way more children than Palestine. 36x more to be exact (between 2008-2020 cuz those are the numbers I could find)

I appreciate the clarification. I posted the same comment in another thread and got some good feedback there too. It was this thread.

I think "terrorist" is a loaded word and I wanted to understand the context because I'm very familiar with the US's history of using the word "terrorist" as a cudgel.

And our history of inserting ourselves, refusing to work with the local democratically elected government, setting up our own candidate in the race and... uh sometimes assassinating the opposition if it looks like the plant isn't going to win. (see Jacobo Arbenz, Mohammad Mosaddeq, Salvador Allende, if you want more listen to "same thing" by Flobots but make sure to verify things after)

But my goal isn't to say Hamas good Israel bad (although I very much laid it all on Netanyahu). My goal was to see if I could absolve Hamas of the "terrorist" label from the US. Without that label it's a lot easier to see the true story of Palestine.

But in the interest of staying focused on how this is a problem with Netanyahu and not the Israeli people I wanna say there were several peace talks brought to my attention (several or most involving Bibi) in the thread that I still need to dig into. And I do intend to keep reading so I can speak more accurately on the topic.

What sort of reply is that to what he said?

An honest one. There's violence everywhere. At least Palestinians and Israelis are fighting each other over land. In America you get shot over a cheeseburger or because someone else can't get laid.

When someone calls the USA out on their school shootings, do you then bring up Ukraine with many more dead?

No, I say "yeah it's unacceptable."

How can you know it was garbage if you didn’t read it?

Fine I read it. You didn't make any valid arguments you just said "yeah but they give a warning". Still doesn't excuse killing amnesty workers. Now go away.

Also, don’t lecture me about debate ethics when you refuse to read any of my arguments.

I didn't read it because it was garbage. More words != better argument

Edit: wait, when did I "lecture you about debate ethics"? I called out a logical fallacy I didn't lecture you. Would you like me to show you the difference?

When you paint yourself into a corner like that your only options are to DIY or try to sweep it under the rug

Whataboutism.

Counterpoint.

My country funds and provides the weapons used for these war crimes. Protesting is about all I can to stop the US from killing more journalists and amnesty workers.

In the hearts of the people I have loved and the nightmares of those who have crossed me. /s

Why?

Warning: serious armchair science going on in my comment here

Probably easy target

I'm guessing this is most of it. Looks like a ~7 minute drive from the border. Actually, to avoid the radar marked on the map they probably came in exactly where I put that purple arrow.

sends a chilling message

Actually I'm saying kinda the opposite. There's 4 schools 7 minutes south, coulda sent a bigger message.

I'm piecing this together as we go. Ok so I checked the distance from Sa'ad to Sderot (30 minutes by car) and while doing so I noticed something.

There was a key on the map I didn't understand "kibbutz portal". Well if you were planning on driving from Sa'ad to Sderot the "kibbutz portal" is the road google maps tells you to start at.

So they probably started here, attacked Sa'ad and then took the "kibbutz portal" to Sderot

Edit: Theres 3 directions out, the purple arrow (25), 232 and the "kibbutz portal". It looks like starting from the purple arrow would allow Hamas to push that town in the direction of the "kibbutz portal". I'm not convinced 25 is open but I'm basing that 100% on the fact that google maps wont let me force the directions to take that road by dropping a pin

Too many words, don't care, didn't read. Don't kill amnesty workers and journalists. No excuses.

45 this year?

Which country has the most school shootings?

The IDF cannot drive people around, it’s not their territory.

Too bad Israel keeps killing amnesty workers or I bet they would volunteer: https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/nine-staffers-working-with-un-palestinian-refugee-agency-killed-air-strikes-gaza-2023-10-11/

Oh lemme guess, it's a feature not a bug?

Prob this: https://www.msnbc.com/katy-tur/watch/70-killed-after-convoys-of-evacuees-in-gaza-hit-by-israeli-strikes-195213381735

It is also an objective fact that only about 1/3 of Palestinian households own a car so for the average able bodied Palestinian it will be a ~4.5 hour walk assuming no traffic