AI Artefacting
areyouevenreal @ areyouevenreal @lemm.ee Posts 9Comments 976Joined 2 yr. ago
areyouevenreal @ areyouevenreal @lemm.ee
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LLMs have legitimate uses today even if they are currently somewhat limited. In the future they will have more legitimate and illegitimate uses. The capabilities of current LLMs are often oversold though, which leads to a lot of this resentment.
Edit: also LLMs very much are AI (specifically ANI) and ML. It's literally a form of deep learning. It's not AGI, but nobody with half a brain ever claimed it was.
The problem is that some people like me won't get that reference and instead think AIs are universally bad. A lot of people already think this way, and it's hard to know who believes what.
They aren't asking C devs to write Rust code, which is what the guy being a heckler was claiming. Why don't they want to right Rust? For exactly the reasons you describe. The thing is though that's not currently being asked of them, all they actually want is the documentation to create that code themselves.
You really don't have to explain any of the culture clash to me lol. I've written both C/C++ and Rust. My C and C++ coding skills are demonstrably better (or at least used to be, it's been a while) than my Rust skills. Why? Because of how complex those guardrails are. The difference is I have the self awareness to know that my lack of Rust skills doesn't mean that the language is bad, or that C is a safe language to use. Rust tutorials could be improved. Perhaps an easier to use language like Zig might be more useful for some people. I feel like it's a good compromise between safety and ease of use. Rust though is still incredibly progressive for the industry, and will improve systems security, maintainability and reliability going forward if only people would stop getting in the way.
AI at this stage is just a tool. This might change one day, but today is not that day. Blame the user, not the tool.
AI and ML was being used to assist in scientific research long before ChatGPT or StableDiffusion hit the mainstream news cycle. AIs can be used to predict all sorts of outcomes, including ones relevant to climate, weather, even medical treatment. The University I work for even have a funded PhD program looking at using AI algorithms to detect cancer better, I found out because one of my friends is applying for it.
The research I am doing with AI is not quite as important as that, but it could shape the future of both cyber security and education, as I am looking at using for teaching cyber security students about ethical hacking and security. Do people also use LLMs to hack businesses or government organisations and cause mayhem? Quite probably, and they definitely will in the future. That doesn't mean that the tool itself is bad, just that some people will inevitably abuse it.
Not all of this stuff is run by private businesses either. A lot of work is done by open source devs working on improving publicly available AI and ML models in their spare time. Likewise some of this stuff is publicly funded through universities like mine. There are people way better than me out there using AIs for all sorts of good things including stopping hackers, curing patients, teaching the next generation, or monitoring climate change. Some of them have been doing it for years.
Netflix is using FreeBSD for servers. You can't blame everything they do wrong as being a problem with the new hires. They are using an OS older than Linux that changes more slowly than Linux, simply because it performs the best for their specific application. Rate of change isn't the issue here.
In fact that's 90% of what this comment is. Blaming new people and new techniques for problems when you aren't a part of that organisation and don't actually know what's happening.
Working with computers is not the same as working with construction equipment. Some degree of fluid intelligence is needed in this field, no matter how experienced you might be, just like how a surgeon needs steady hands. The people you call greybeards aren't nearly as old as your father is. We are talking about people who are in their 50s and 40s. They don't have that level of cognitive decline yet. Likewise some things like ext4 aren't likely going to be ported to Rust now or even ever. They can keep maintaining them as they are now for the foreseeable future. Plus I don't want people to have to keep working into their 70s and 80s. At some point it becomes elder abuse. Let people retire man.
C has existed for a long time now. We've been trying to replace it for ages, for most of it's lifespan even. C++ actually was one of the new options at one point. I get it seemed immovable only a decade ago, and I think that has lulled people into a false sense of security. In truth it was inevitable it would have to be replaced one day. It's already well outlived the life expectancy of a programming language. Just think about Ruby: created long after C yet has already become mostly irrelevant. You talk about the maximum rate of tool change, but C is one of the oldest tools we have, keeping it around would be almost 0 rate of tool change over decades. If you can't see that C is very slowly dying then you haven't seen the writing on the wall for the past several years. It's on you at that point.
We should look back with pride at everything that has been accomplished with C, and just how long it's been relevant. We can do this while still acknowledging it needs to be phased out gradually.
No one is asking for change that rapid either. Linux started adopting Rust four years ago now. It's probably still going to have C code inside it for at least a decade from now. This isn't some quick change, it's a gradual process. People have plenty of time to adapt, and those who are too old to do so will be around retirement agent if not already dead by the time C is fully phased out.
We of course play plenty of video games together to keep him sharp. We also eat mushrooms, paper when necessary, and he works out a lot. We do all we can, believe me.
Honestly you take more care of yourself and your father than I do. I am only in my 20s and suck at video games. If I took mushies or LSD I would probably lose my mind, assuming it's all still there in the first place. I suspect there is a good reason why people like me only have a life expectancy of 58 or so.
C has been around for a very long time. I don't think wanting to replace a 1970s language, that was old when current gray beards were young is a bad thing. People have had more than enough time, and still have a good decade or two to make their careers writing and maintaining C code. Sometimes things have to change, old people be damned. It's diatribes like this that remind me the human race advances one body at a time as those holding us back die out.
Edit: also we aren't talking about people in their 70s and 80s here. Most of these "greybeards" are in their 40s and 50s at most. Linux itself is from the 1990s and is therefore more modern than C.
At this point you might as well complain about the mods and admins on Lemmy as tons of them are out of wack. I have had comments removed for stating facts that every should know just because it doesn't agree with the lemmy hivemind. For example say anything positive about AI or how it was used before the likes of ChatGPT came around.
That might be true but it's not what happened at that specific conference. I beg you watch the clip to see what happened. Also fuck programmers with the attitude you describe. It's been proven wrong over and over again with so many C memory safety vulnerabilities.
That to me sounds like exactly the reason why developers like the above have left. They are having to take on the burden of gently letting down other devs who are angry over a simple misunderstanding. A misunderstanding that wouldn't have happened if they had been listening or bothered to ask first before jumping to conclusions. Imagine someone heckles you on stage and you have to respond kindly. I certainly wouldn't. If someone had listened to my talk, misinterpreted it, then heckled me over it you can bet I would be angry and would respond in kind. To then see this misinformation being spread again would drive me nuts. I can see why they left.
The bottom line for me is that Rust devs who work on this stuff for free shouldn't be getting hounded by C devs just for asking for proper documentation that frankly they should have provided in the first place. I say this as someone who is skeptical of Rust for various reasons.
Unfortunately there are a lot of problems created by using C in the kernel, and having all of this done manually. Many kernel vulnerabilities including several severe ones have been due to issues with memory management. Even the whitehouse has spoken on these issues related to C. Rust has been proven to be comparable to C in terms of performance, sometimes even faster. So it doesn't make a great deal of sense to keep using C for new projects.
That all being said Rust has had its own issues. There was a recent vulnerability in older versions of cargo the Rust package manager for instance. It's a somewhat new language so obviously teething issues are to be expected, and it might be too soon to use Rust for mission critical systems. It's also a harder language to learn and understand, so that makes adopting it more difficult especially for very experienced C developers like those who work on the Linux kernel. It might be better to wait and see what other languages like Zig and Carbon manage to do, but those are even newer and will take more time to actually be production ready.
I think the point of redox is more than just rewriting Linux in Rust. Architecturally they are very different. Redox uses the more modern microkernel approach, whereas Linux is a modular monolith. There are advantages and disadvantages to both designs. They are actually polar opposites in fact. The compromise is something called a hybrid kernel which is used by Windows NT.
This isn't a disagreement. One person is stating something incorrect. You can disagree on opinion, but facts are facts. The person being referred to here isn't asking others to learn Rust, they are just asking for more information about the already existing C code so that they can write their Rust code to interoperate with it. This misunderstanding is exactly why that developer was getting heckled on stage, and is the reason why now one has left the project. I would appreciate it if you didn't make a misunderstanding sound like a valid opinion. Enough damage has already been done.
They mean neuroatypical, which is the same as neurodivergent. Just decided to spell it weirdly for some reason.
Neurotypical means literally none of those things, it's the exact opposite. I think you mean neurodivergent or neuroatypical. Aneurotypical is basically a misspelling of the latter.
COSMIC itself has a similar design to macOS
Maybe I haven't explained myself well enough. For many people it's a choice not between prescription vs illicit. It's a choice between illicit Adderall vs illicit cannabis, alcohol, nicotine, and anything else they can get their hands on. That's what happens when people aren't getting the medication and healthcare that they need. They take their problems to other substances and behaviors.
To be clear this isn't something I would want to try unless I had no other option. I am lucky that my University does testing for ADHD, and am hoping to get tested one day. I also already have an autism diagnosis, so already get some support, meaning it's not as high a priority for me as it is for someone completely undiagnosed.
I've already tried substances similar to amphetamine like cocaine, and honestly don't find them that pleasant. I am not in any real hurry to try that again. So I also doubt amphetamines are my thing.
I do find it interesting though that stories like yours happen. I've tried some very dangerous and addictive things including xanax, valium, ketamine, amphetamine, nicotine as well as the previously mentioned cocaine and honestly none of them took. I can only conclude that either I have no addictive tendencies or that I haven't tried the right class of substance yet. It's almost impossible for me to imagine being in your position. I guess it comes down to genetics or something.
I will note as well that if you can become addicted to the street version then that means you would have become addicted to the doctor prescribed version eventually too given enough time. It's similar to how pain patients end up addicted to opioids. I am glad you are doing better though.
What even are those?
Yes it's not an ideal solution. If it's between self medicating with other drugs versus getting the thing you should be prescribed with through illicit means I would choose the latter. Ideally healthcare would be free everywhere and getting a diagnosis wouldn't take literal years or even a decade. That's unfortunately not the world we live in. I have friends that were referred years ago on the NHS and are still waiting.
This is false. Anyone who has used these tools for long enough can tell you this is false.
LLMs have been used to write computer code, craft malware, and even semi-independently hack systems with the support of other pieces of software. They can even grade student's work and give feedback, but it's unclear how accurate this will be. As someone who actually researches the use of both LLMs and other forms of AI you are severely underestimating their current capabilities, never mind what they can do in the future.
I also don't know where you came to the conclusion that hardware performance is always an issue, given that LLM model size varies immensely as does the performance requirements. There are LLMs that can run and run well on an average laptop or even smartphone. It honestly makes me think you have never heard of LLaMa models inc. TinyLLaMa or similar projects.
You can filter data you get from the internet to websites archived before LLMs were even invented as a concept. This is trivial to do for some data sets as well. Some data sets used for this training have already been created without LLM output (think about how the first LLM was trained).
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