Pan_Ziemniak @ Pan_Ziemniak @midwest.social

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1 yr. ago

Ill tell the ppl of Ukraine, sorry, but biden dont care about Gaza, so fuck off!

Or the equivalent of voting for trump, anyway. And also note that they seem very angry over the notion that ppl will vote for biden while pursuing other forms of change or at the very least advocating for them.

Its not prediction, russia repeatedly has called Ukraine a stepping stone. I would appreciate it if it werent.

It is maleable, if it werent, the right wouldnt expe d the dollars and effort it does into keeping voters from casting their votes.

And we got biden over trump, as u said, the youth is more left, and the old generation is dying.

Mutual aid, direct action, votes for biden to keep the fascist out, and solidarity.

Well.... i should save face somehow....hmmm.....

pursue mutual aid then, fuckface, since we must argue!!! I bet u hate that!!!1!🤬😡🤬😡

/s

Sorry too much internet

The spoiler effect is real, amigo.

U get Status Quo Joe, or u get the russian nazi. Under biden our abilities to organize and pursue whatever courses of action are not under threat. Thats not true the other way around. If it was, youd be seeing leftists actually doing something in russia or china, but it doesnt happen. Bc they get the boot. Like how the communist party that still exists in russia is only some 30yrs old bc it was the one that was hand picked to exist as controlled opposition.

I dont blame u for being depressed and disaffected, but i assure u, this country has a long way to go before it hits rock bottom. Meanwhile, I would prefer it if Poland and Lithuania werent next on Putins chopping block bc donnie twatkins and his maga cult decided fuck it, Ukraine dont deserve arms. This whole movement ive been seeing, first on reddit now here, saying voting is childish or that third party is the way to go... its all foreign sourced. If voting didnt matter, the right in this country wouldnt go to the lengths it does to suppress it. Low turn out benefits trump. Trump benefits countries that are hostile towards us. Those countries have a vested interest in ur vote.

Pre api changes on reddit, leftist spaces on reddit didnt ban ppl, they didnt remove comments, and they prided themselves on encouraging independent thinking. Suddenly after, i started picking up bans even from places like rightcantmeme bc id call out russian talking points or the fact that making fun of "vooting" wasnt praxis, just a cheap slogan to wave around the way magats wave theirs. And ghen new spaces, like ultraleft, started popping up. These new spaces outright were based around the new culture, and here something interesting started happening. Ppl (or trolls, idk) would pop in and ask, "whats the ancom (or whichever other subgroup) stance on ____?" And of course they got a bunch of cookie cutter opinions to plug in their brains and be able to turn off their critical thinking.

There was a time when the leftists there would put down such notions, telling everyone to think for themselves and that u fit where u fit. Theyd ask for the persons beliefs that they already held and ask them to debate those. All in the name of conversation. It was never about telling ppl what to think.

But here today, fuck man... im writing all this out to u bc u sound real. This shit here, all the talk of not voting or voting third party... its all the same. Its all sourced from the same, and half these accounts that spout this bs turn really vile when u suggest that damage control voting even if u suggest direct action and mutual aid in the very same comment.

Note that the Spanish anarchists still participate in their democracy. Bc they state one of their goals as making life more tenable under the current regime for everyone. If u want change, u need to still work within the system alongside whatever else u believe in. As said, if u didnt, the dictatorships u see around the world would be positively teeming with lefitst action and thought. But they aint. Bc thats not how things ever go.

Do take note how aggressive these ppl/accounts get at the notions of ppl voting blue.

We need solidarity, not more division. Go vote for the infinitely less shit candidate, then pursue whatever additional means u feel make changes happen. If ur wasting ur time yelling at ppl for voting or calling them stupid, ur just sowing division.

Well we get to have a monoparty system in the inverse, but i guess technically ceasing to exist would be a change for dems.

Given that 2016 was decided by 20k votes spread across three states, id say that yeah, every person on Lemmy might swing the election.

The spoiler effect is real, and ur not going to get a chance for third party candidates to ever matter if the raging turnip were to win.

And then theyd get chinese or russian imperialism. Geopolitics is a thing whether u ignore it or not. The US at least is maleable and every year i hear the leftists get louder and more numerous.

I disagree that having these conversations on lemmy is playing into the "neoliberal spin machine" (great term, btw). My conversation is aimed at leftists in hopes of building pan-leftist solidarity, or something of that nature. This is where plenty of leftists hang out online, so this is a reasonable place to have this discussion.

You are spot on that phonebanking, canvassing, and harassing ur rep is more effective at getting ppl to vote for Status Quo Joe.

That sounds like mutual aid to me, whereas protesting/striking/[REDACTED] are direct action, but whatever, fuck the definitions. We clearly want the same. Keep organizing and building bridges, ur spot on.

The right relies on ppl to be exploited so they dont have the time nor the expedience in critical thinking to be able to tell what needs be done. This is why its important to maintain some amount of sympathetic perspective towards others. The left leaning neoliberals i meet arent enemies. They are victims of propaganda. Opening up lines of communication, building bridges, showing u understand their side by voting for damage control, these earn sympathies.

If Biden ceased supporting israel, our remaining allies would be all the more disillusioned with our fickle ass nature and our soft powers would plummet.

Guarantee you, if we had a president Sanders, 70 senators would be tripping over themselves to pass Israeli aid and overturning any of his executive orders while calling him an antisemite.

They recommend nothing at all.

Remember comrades,

-Direct action (strike, strike, strike, preferably imo, and hold ur surplus value hostage)

-Mutual aid

-Voting to ensure you can pursue the first 2 with minimal govt interference

All are acceptable avenues. All are necessary. None are mutually exclusive.

Youre talking about neolib politicians. You should be pursuing direct action for the changes u seek. Your vote is there as damage control to ensure we can still pursue other avenues of change or mutual aid without persecution.

"Support genocide" in this case means not abandoning a 70 year ally when our other allies are already worried we are fickle and support or dont support them based on whos in charge every 4 years.

Under dump Eastern Europe gets trampled and the rest of Europe gets pulled into open war.

We will not teach democrats accountability by throwing our democracy down the pisser to spite them and never have another chance to vote.

He has forgiven student loans, reunited children it their families at the border, and he is the first president to so openly acknowledge and put forth anything towards climate change.

The other option is daddy big boot stamping down on anyone who doesnt think like he.

To push left, all increments of change should be embraced. Those who stage disruptive strikes will get the majority of my respect, but by diversifying efforts we reach further ends.

Yeah. They are. They simp for authoritarians. A over hexbear they believe in the "denazification" of Ukraine...

There wont be accountability left if dump wins.

"Too late to stop him(trump)"

Really? Bc it sure seems like it aint.

The spoiler effect means voting for third party is essentially a vote for trump, so we must vote for the lesser evil. Look to the Spanish anarchists. Theyve a politically engaged political party since the late 1800s bc the second tenet they list is to make life more tenable under the current (in their eyes) transitory system.

We must pursue direct action, establish systems of mutual aid, and we must vote to keep the russian agent from criminalizing leftists for thoughtcrime.

Every available avenue is to be taken, bc we dont get to be picky, and every leftward push should be embraced regardless of how far or little it pushes. Its the sum of parts that counts. You think MLK jr would refuse to stage disruptive protests bc the man standing next to him might not yet be disillusioned with capital as much as he? That is what solidarity means. Solidarity to even those that u disagree with.