BlitzoTheOisSilent @ BlitzoTheOisSilent @lemmy.world

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1 yr. ago

The DNC during their campaign to save democracy refused to compromise with their base on genocide.

To reiterate, genocide.

And after they lost, they threw trans people and the left under the bus.

So what makes you all think they're going to change their stance on anything now? They're already screaming that the DNC was too far left during this campaign, this campaign, where they unapologetically and unconditionally showed support to a fascist and his genocide.

They had Republican after Republican parade across their convention stage, but had zero Palestinian Democrats come speak despite requests from the Uncommitted Protest movement.

What's that thing all of Lemmy is always saying, "When people show you who they are, believe them?" They're showing you who they are and who they want to be, so believe them. There's no saving the DNC, it's just a slow march to fascism under them versus the speed run with the Republicans.

Two Democratic politicians already threw trans people under the bus, saying the party is too left on trans-issues, and then parroting the "people don't want biological boys in girl's sports" bullshit.

And then that one Dem who ran the campaign ad "I've never pushed for sex changes," or something like that.

I'm trans too, and honestly, I will never be supporting the DNC again after hearing that from two of their congressional members.

We're well aware, and it's honestly getting old hearing "wElL tHe ReSt Of ThE wOrLd," yeah, the UK voted to leave the EU and ousted a party to replace them with Labour who don't want to hold another referendum on the vote.

India continues to elect the populist and nationalist Modi as their PM, because he gives them bags of rice with his name on them and tells them it's ok to hate Muslims.

Germany is flirting with fascism again, and they've got all the stuff Americans are apparently too fucking stupid to get done, right?

Dutch police just rounded up a bunch of pro-Palestinian protesters, protesting peacefully, and then started beating them for not moving fast enough.

Oh, and the majority of European countries are freaking the fuck out about immigration and the floods of immigrants trying to come into their countries. And funnily enough, your politicians speak about immigrants the same way our Republicans do.

But you're right, the people who weren't alive 50 years ago when all of this should have been done, yeah, that's our fucking fault too, right?

They raised over a billion dollars after Harris got the nomination.

They spent a quarter of that on sending door knockers to the same people's houses 2-3 times.

And they donate money to Republican outsider campaigns to try to siphon votes off the Republican incumbent (who they usually still lose to anyway).

They would absolutely spend millions of dollars thinking they were going to lose. It's not their money, and their lives will not change whether it's spent or not.

Yep, and I have friends who have a lot of their social events and stuff there. I usually politely decline if I'm invited.

Didn't Trump try this with the DEA and states that legalised marijuana? Something about they wanted to start going after individuals and stuff because it's still federally illegal?

I just remember a majority of the state's said, "Go for it, but we're not helping you in any way." And they basically dropped it.

I'm hopeful similar situations will hold.

Unfortunately, we don't all have the choice to jump ship. 🤷‍♀️

I wasn't fired, but I resigned from a brewery/coffee shop I worked at after only 7 shifts. Context: I'm trans and in the closet still.

Hired as a cook for this brewery, and based on the interview, I'm one of the more "experienced" cooks on the team, and they (owners) were hoping I'd be able to help make the kitchen more professional. It's a part-time gig, so sure, I'll do what I can.

Well, the kitchen was too small for the facility. They would have to stop taking orders on busy nights an hour before close because they didn't have the space to get through the 40+ orders that came in within 5 minutes of each other. Orders from both the bar, the cafe they had, and to go orders.

They're menu was fine, surprisingly, they didn't stretch themselves too thin. But the staff were... Rough. The kitchen supervisor couldn't believe I owned a chef's coat, nevermind actually showed up to work in one since everyone just wore t-shirts (no aprons, as far as I could find). I told the owners they should have chef coats, it's a safety thing, etc, idk if that ever happened.

Anyway, the kitchen supe would spend 90% of the shift video chatting with various friends/family/etc during his shift, loudly dropping the n-word every other word while we're cooking and cleaning and prepping. All on the line, not even in an office or something, in the middle of the kitchen. I've had managers who are lazy, that's fine, but I've never had one that unprofessional.

There were like 2-3 shifts though where the bulk of the conversation amongst the kitchen staff were LGBTQ+ focused: I'm not sure I could love my daughter if she was a lesbian, I don't understand this stuff, it's a mental illness, trans people, etc. If it had happened once, fine, whatever. But over 2-3 different shifts, and the supervisor is taking part? No, I'm not cool with that.

My last shift, I'm annoyed and pretty over my coworkers based on their views I got to listen to, but trying to just get through it. I'm working the deep fryer, reheating some chicken wings. Pull the basket up and grab the thermometer to temp them when the supervisor calls over, "Oh, no, you don't need to temp those, they're already cooked!"

I pulled him aside after and asked him about that, and he goes, "Yeah, we already cooked them to 165°F before we cooled and stored them. You've just gotta get em heated up again, you don't have to temp them."

I send an almost 2-page long resignation to the owners the next day, explaining that I did not appreciate the conversations taking place in the kitchen and the opinions about people my coworkers had, people who may very well he standing in the room with them.

But I really harped on the fact that the kitchen supervisor, the supervisor, didn't seem to be familiar with health code policies. Any good that's already been cooked and then cooled must be brought back to 165°F when being reheated, that's, like, one of those food safety things every pro cook should know, nevermind a supervisor.

I advised they may want to send their supervisors for food safety retraining before they made a customer sick, and that there were too many issues within the kitchen for me to help them without basically cleaning house and starting over.

This is what I've been trying to get across to the people screeching about anyone who didn't vote versus voting for Harris (I voted for Harris, just fyi, begrudgingly).

Voters were vocally and publically opposed to the genocide in Palestine being aided by the Biden admin, but the DNC would not back down, making these half-ass "Well, if Israel crossed the fifth line we drew, ooh, they're really in for it this time! That next phone call, I'm gonna use the F word!"

Voters were making their concerns and their internal conflict known online, and they were either outright attacked for being a Trump supporter (y'know, instead of a human being trying to weigh which lives matter more in their voting decision). Or, you were told that we just had to bite the bullet "one more time," and then this time we'll be able to get the party to listen to us, and start to move in progressive directions.

But when you pointed out that there was no way to know the DNC would actually listen based on 2016 and 2020, and the fact the longer the campaign went on the further right Harris and her policies shifted... You were dismissed and screamed at for being a Trump supporter.

And this just proves to me that the DNC was never, has never, and will never compromise with their voting base on anything. Period. Even now, what are DNC pundits going on the news and saying? "The voters failed us, the DNC went too far left this election, the voters are tired of "wOkE" policies, I've even heard two Democratic politicians throw trans people under the bus.

The party of supposed LGBTQ+ lost an election and immediately turned on one of the most marginalized groups of their voting base.

But no, no, they'll totally listen to us after we get them elected and give them over a billion dollars in campaign money. 🙄

I had a friend in the Navy back around 2015 that wholeheartedly believed that this is why America would fail.

The US government is the longest, unchanged Democracy in the world. We've had the same documents, modified slightly but not enough, as the rule of land for almost 250 years now.

He equated it to a white board that, over 250 years, kept having stuff added to it, but nothing was "removed," just crossed out and something written next to it, or over it.

And now 250 years later, we've essentially resorted to trying to fill the spaces between lines and letters and around the margins, but they've already been filled, so we're just writing over what's already written.

Fair enough. I would work on how you phrase your argument, cause I don't think I'm the only one who thought you were defending neoliberalism and liberalism.

But the Dems need to use the data and facts or non-corporate economists then, and message it so the average American understands this will mean more money for them, better benefits, protections, and comfort.

They're not going to research the positions and research of economists they've never heard of. They don't have the time, and many don't care, they just want to know if the end result will actually benefit them or not.

Not saying that's how it should be, but that it is how it is. Hence why I was saying a political machine with decades of ivy league education between them and millions of dollars at their disposal need to figure out how to get the 60% of Americans who don't vote, to vote.

And ignoring the human factor of politics while doubling down on data and facts that the average American couldn't relate to was a huge contributing factor for Harris losing.

What would that be?

Biden adopted policies from Bernie's platform in 2020. Bernie runs on a solidly progressive (at least for the US) platform with actual goals and steps to reach them.

His campaign has admitted that, they know progressive policies will win.

The liberals at least have specifics, they have a system.

The liberals have the status quo, which Americans repeatedly poll they don't feel is working for them anymore and they want change, and "we're not the Republicans."

I wouldn't call that specifics or a system, it's just "We're not the other guys." There's nothing in their messaging to give people hope.

And, just to add: these are supposed to be people who were elected to work on behalf of their constituents, many touting ivy league degrees and law careers.

They know what policies are popular, and they're supposed to be so smart, so why can't they figure out how to make it happen? Like, is their job supposed to be showing up to cast a vote a few times a year? They're supposed to be hearing our problems and finding solutions to them.

It's not enough the electorate has to give them money and support them regardless of their unpopular policies, they need us to draft their legislation too?

What would those be?

Bernie's 2016 and 2020 platforms, to use at the bare minimum as a framework to build off of.

A minimum wage increase that actually reflects what the American worker should be earning, with it tied to inflation.

Student loan forgiveness, that seems to be a big one. I'd argue they'd win a lot of people over if they ran on a platform to forgive credit card debt accrued during the insanity that was the Pandemic.

Stronger workers rights and stronger unions.

The end to price gouging and corporate greed. Making stock buybacks illegal or heavily fined, mandating money be put back into the company, taxing corporations and the wealthy via the appropriate means, ending tax loopholes for the wealthy. >

Ending Citizen's United, enshrining abortion/bodily autonomy/LGBTQ+ rights into law, enshrining voting rights, automatic voter registration at the age of 18, making voting day a federal holiday, or even making voting mandatory to ensure larger turnout.

Getting rid of the electoral college, changing FPTP, age limits or reform for elected officials, ending lifetime appointments for SCOTUS, SCOTUS ethics laws with actual teeth, expanding the SCOTUS.

I came up with those based on conversations with friends and coworkers and by just casually paying attention to the news. I have an associates degree from a community college, why am I being expected to brainstorm and come up with ideas for a liberal elite with ivy league training and access to national polls and research, and millions of dollars to further test which ideas would resound with voters.

Or go ask the Dems who won reelection on progressive platforms despite those states going to Trump. Or ask the electorate like they're supposed to during the primaries, but the DNC robbed us of those again because their hubris said "We're not fascism, regardless of candidate" would be enough to win.

And before you start "But Biden did those things/Harris campaigned on those things," did she? A significant chunk of Americans didn't know Biden dropped out on election day, do you really think they care about the minutiae of campaign policy? And do you really expect them to be inspired when they're being told "We're just gonna maintain the course"?

I don't.

Then why keep defending it? The left and progressives keep asking for anything progressive, and the liberals ask us to meet them in the middle. We do, they take a step back, and ask us to meet them in the middle again.

They either run on progressive ideas, and put in the work I would expect of a mulimillion dollar national political organization to figure out what those policies are. From working class Americans, not their corporate masters deciding everything for us.

Or they keep losing. Americans want change, and they're tired of the excuses from the Dems while Repubs actually get things done. And make their constituents feel heard. Unlike the dem liberals, who seem to think they're enlightened and entitled to condescend to the rest of us because they know better. Their facts and data and evidence says so.

Yes, it did. It lost conclusively. But it's not liberalism. My ideology is democratic socialism, and, yeah, it lost. It was a massacre.

So you're either a troll, or completely out of touch with reality.

A Democratic socialist is asking me for popular, progressive policies that would reflect what the average person would want, while defending liberalism as a "necessary evil" because we don't know if any other system would be popular?

So let's just try nothing, got it.

I'm done with this conversation, at best your eyes wide shut, and at worst you're a troll. Any further information I have to convey, or any further questions you have that you think will be so profound, will be searchable via Google.

I'd recommend you start there, maybe with Bernie's website, since you claim to be a Democratic Socialist but don't seem to be familiar with the progressive platform of probably the most open and self-identified Democratic Socialist in American politics: Bernie Sanders.

Breathe*

Thirst*

Feed*

but if the problem isn't ideology itself but just that we have the wrong ideology in place,

If it's the wrong ideology in place, the ideology itself is wrong. This is redundant.

what do we replace it with?

Well, we keep trying liberalism and centrism, and it's not working, so how about literally anything else other than conservatism/fascism?

What's the "right" ideology?

The one that actually benefits the people who are supposed to be represented by the system instead of the wealthy elite at the top. It's literally that simple:

Campaign on popular policies that the working and average person will actually want and benefit from.

I don't want a worse ideology to replace liberalism, just because some people believed it was better.

Then keep running liberalist campaigns, shifting right every election, and keep snagging those L's.

Y'all keep thinking liberalism will work, and y'all keep demonstrably losing, so why are you so sure liberalism is better than any other ideology without trying anything else?

but let's use facts, data, and evidence to determine what that better ideology would be.

So just continue ignoring the electorate and their human and emotional wants and needs, and thus, keep losing. Got it. 👍

And you wonder why millions of Democrats stayed home. "I believe we should change the system, but I don't think the system is worth changing without hard facts, data, and evidence."

Go look at the 2024 election results, bud, and then check out the 2016 results, and then the skin-of-their-teeth 2020 Democratic win, and you'll see all the data, facts, and evidence you need.

Your ideology lost, and the fact y'all keep thinking "maybe if we do it again, but more conservative" is going to work election after election. It's literally the definition of insanity, but you want facts and evidence?

Sure.

Seriously, look at the beauty standards and treatments of the Victorian era.

Women would squeeze citric acid in their eyes because they believe it cleaned them and whitened them, and the burning sensation was just the germs being cleaned.

Biden isn't a strongman dictator, so Trump won't respect him or anything he has to say.

I'm talking about belief being replaced by data, facts, and evidence.

Biden and Harris just did this with the economy and lost every swing state, plus the electoral college and the popular vote.

You cannot tell people their lived reality is wrong because numbers on a piece of paper say otherwise.

You can't remove human emotions and feelings from humanity, and it looks pretty clear to me that the average American feels like liberalism isn't working for them, despite the economic numbers saying everything is great.

It's about making a distinction between subjective ideals and morals, and objective truths.

Ok, here's a truth: centrist liberalism cost the Democrats the election, as evidenced by the fact progressive policies were passed in states that didn't vote for Harris.

The Democrats, as evidenced by 2016 and 2024 (and arguably 2016), cannot win with just their liberal base. They need to court other voters, and they chose in 2016 and now 2024 to move right and try to court Republicans, who statistically will not vote for Democrats, instead of trying to appeal to the leftist/progressive wing of the party.

Sure seems like the data and the people are repudiating liberalism, so... Sure sounds like liberalism is the wrong one here, otherwise, wouldn't they have won?

Jon Richardson, yes, that screenshot is from 8 Out of 10 Cats does Countdown, which Jon is actually pretty good at (assuming the whole show isn't just a comedy script turned into a word/number game), and one of the Team Captains for the show.

Yep, keep plugging your ears and telling yourself the voting base that wasn't represented in either candidate stayed home and it's their fault.

Not the fault of an unpopular platform telling Americans the numbers on their papers and charts are more important than their lived reality.

CiAo 🙄

The average person wants change, they want the system that is actively oppressing them to change.

Trump has promised change. It's the worst imaginable, but he's promised it, he's made his voters feel heard and seen, and he showed them he was willing to upend the whole system to make change happen.

Harris told the American people she wouldn't significantly be different than Biden and that we "Weren't going back," which just sounds like "Status Quo with extra steps" to the average American. And when the voting base asked for something progressive to excite them, something to vote for, the DNC scolded them that the time wasn't right like they did in 2016, and 2020, and 2024, and probably 2028 at this point.

The system isn't working and people want change. Trump promises to change things up (for worse, again, to be clear), Harris promised to maintain the status quo that isn't working. I imagine after being disenfranchised and disillusioned election cycle after election cycle, and being ignored with fascism at the door...

I'm not saying it's right, but I think America chose negative change to maintaining the status quo for another 4 years. Which... If 2016 wasn't the canary in the coal mine, I would hope 2024 would be for the DNC. Turning further right is losing them their own voters while trying to win over Republicans who will never vote for them.

Their voting base is tired of being told now isn't the time for compromise/policy changes in the party, but then watching the party change policy and compromise with Republicans. You can't tell your voting base you'd rather be Fascist-lite than work with them, and be surprised when they refuse to support you. 🤷‍♀️