Uvalde school shooting victims' families announce $2 million settlement with Texas city and new lawsuits
Uvalde school shooting victims' families announce $2 million settlement with Texas city and new lawsuits
Any settement that doesn't penalize non-reactive cops is too little, imo.
Over 300 officer from state and federal.
There's more people to sue, is what I'm saying
What bothers me most about this is the huge amount of ignorance all sides have on this subject.
The issue IMO, is the fucking AR-15. Police Officers immediately went in when they knew there were problems, but when the subject had an AR-15 that could literally shoot through school walls (ie: Police Officers were outgunned and out-matched), they retreated.
Yes, there was a few hours where they were too scared to do anything, further traumatizing the children / teachers. But this is fucking it. Talk about the firepower and the tactical decision to retreat.
Handguns CANNOT compete against an AR15. The AR15 has superior power, penetration, and accuracy. The officers made the right decision to retreat, regroup, and further come up with a new plan initially. Though their cowardice in the face of the AR15 is what needs to be highlighted most of all.
There's nothing wrong with being scared of a bigger, more accurate, more powerful gun with more ammunition. If they truly were outgunned, then retreat was the best option (otherwise, officers would have died and that would have forced a retreat while carrying a slain officer around, a much harder task). Shit gets bad to worse in a combat situation if you don't outgun the opponent.
Dinky handguns won't do shit against the body armor of the attacker either.
This is literally the case where liberals need to come together, understand the mechanics of the gun involved and push for better gun control laws. If officers in Texas get outgunned and are forced to retreat, then support those officers and push for gun legislation. Everyone knows these bigger guns serve as cop-killers and ultimately fuck our society over. Just quit being dumbass snowflakes about blue-lives-matter or pro-Police stances or whatever.
Being pro-Police here AND anti-gun is the right move in this case. But instead, Liberals fuck over their own politics because they're too braindead to play their cards right.
Conservatives clearly care more about guns than Police Officers. Punish the Conservative view ya pansies.
The cops had AR15s, body armor, helmets, flash bang grenades, the works. They also outnumbered the shooter 376 to 1. The shooters vest had no armor plating.
https://www.texastribune.org/2022/05/27/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-timeline/
Also note: I'm talking about 11:40am. These are the pre-SWAT police officers who rushed into the building almost immediately after the shooter entered the building.
SWAT doesn't arrive until 12:10pm.
So no. For the time-period between 11:40am to 12:10pm, Police are just armed with whatever they got. Normal officers don't go around with Flash Bangs, Body Armor, AR15s. Most officers just have a handgun until SWAT arrives.
Cool.
Now take that highly-penetrative AR15 and shoot it into a school building, knowing full well that the bullets will penetrate the walls and kill the people on the other side of the school.
Even when everyone has an AR15, the shooter still has the advantage, because he had the children hostage. There were also questions on whether the school was clear before any potential shootout (see the problem with AR15's huge amount of penetration: shooting through the attacker and hitting children in another room is a serious concern still even as SWAT arrives).
Even when you give everyone the works, the problem at play here was the AR15 in the hands of the shooter, which required the police to take a step back and rework tactics entirely.
Thinking from the perspective of the cops side will 100% give yall a ton of evidence and logical arguments to fuck up the pro-gun AR15 lobby. Just think damn it.
If the cops can't figure out how to suppress and flank one guy they should resign.
Cops aren't warriors.
There's another bullshit thing we need to get rid of. Cops are NOT swat team. And the idea of a "Warrior-cop" is one of the worst fucking things in our culture right now.
Liberals have been asking cops to stand down and be more kind for the last decade and suddenly in this case, yall are asking them to be militant warriors again.
No. Leave the "warriors" to the SWAT team at best, and I'm not even convinced that SWAT is a good idea for all cities to have. Warrior-cop mentality is one of the worst things going on in this country right now, and I want to speak against it.
Cops aren't soldiers. They're supposed to be community members. In other countries, cops don't even carry guns.
This is one of the dumbest takes i have ever read on this site and that is saying something. I really hope you can go through some introspection and have a paradigm shift. Its not easy to change but goddamn. I sincerely hope youre just an ignorant kid.
The fact that you can't respond to OPs points speaks volumes. It is fine if you don't like the conclusion, but you won't convince anyone of anything if you are unable to form rebuttals to their points.
No you.
The gunman enters the school at 11:35am. Pre-SWAT officers charge after the gunman almost immediately afterwards. Initial skirmishes between the Police (with only handguns) immediately show that they were outgunned. Officers ask for SWAT team backup by 11:40am.
Read the fucking report.
There is zero reason to be pro-police here.
And who gives a fuck about the weapon used. That does not excuse their lack of action.
Rightists always have such misguided takes.
The people defending the police here are literally saying that the children should fend for themselves in situations like this because it's too dangerous for the police.
Fuck. That. Noise.
The thin yellow line, everyone. Laugh and point whenever you see the blue stripe on the American flag. It's a joke.
Would you rush in to suicide yourself if you knew that it wouldn't help anything?
And who gives a fuck about the weapon used. That does not excuse their lack of action.
Pistols don't beat AR15 rifles. If the opponent outguns you, you need to wait for backup and bigger guns. Basic tactics.
And if everyone is using big guns during a hostage situation, the "Good Guys" have a huge disadvantage due to the penetrative effects of powerful guns. Good Guys don't want to kill children with missed (or even hit) shots. A headshot vs the shooter would not only penetrate the shooter's skull, but also the wall behind the shooter. A wall that you're not sure if the children or the teachers of the school were hiding behind yet.
For all anyone cares every body of a child there should have been the body of a cop trying to rush that room.
Guns aren't Yu-Gi-Oh where the highest attack power wins.
There’s nothing wrong with being scared of a bigger, more accurate, more powerful gun with more ammunition. If they truly were outgunned, then retreat was the best option (otherwise, officers would have died and that would have forced a retreat while carrying a slain officer around, a much harder task). Shit gets bad to worse in a combat situation if you don’t outgun the opponent.
Go to war? We can't do that, the other side have guns!
Soldier/Warrior-cop mentality is fucking toxic bro. I don't accept it from conservatives, and I certainly don't accept it from the hypocritical liberals who talk both sides on this issue.
At least the conservatives are consistent with the warrior-cop mentality and do what they believe in.
Go to war?
Cops don't go to war. In most cases, cops deal with rowdy teenagers or people running naked across school property or other such more typical day-to-day cases. They aren't (and shouldn't) be equipped to deal with armed shooters.
Cops who study warrior / soldier mentality become too mean, gain the us-vs-them mentality and fuck shit up. Its one of the biggest problems in our country, and I outright refuse anyone who makes war-analogies to cop situations.
TL;DR: ACAB
Police have all the tools in the world there is no excuse for their lack of action while children are being killed.
No they don't and Cops shouldn't have those tools.
I'd be far more comfortable if in these cases of national emergency, the National Guard showed up with actual heavy weapon experience and training. SWAT is a decent compromise (a few units of specialized / highly trained cops). But we should not make the "typical" cop go down the journey towards warrior / soldier.
STFU moron.
iT wAs JuSt A fEw HoUrS!!!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/5.56%C3%9745mm_NATO#
"There has been much debate of the allegedly poor performance of the bullet on target in regard to stopping power, lethality, and range. Some of this criticism has been used to advocate an intermediate-sized cartridge between the 5.56 and 7.62 NATO sizes."
The AR15 is typically chambered in .556, a medium sized cartridge typically pretty lacking in stopping power especially when compared to other popular firearms like the M1 Garand chambered in 30-06 much actually does penetrate much further that .556
$2M each, right? Right?!
I agree this seems low, but this is just a settlement with the city. Hopefully they'll get more from other organizations.
One of the many things that suck about these situations is that the money comes from the community, so they get the worst outcomes on both sides no matter what.
It comes from the insurance companies pocket to whom the community has been paying premium for a long time. It has been paid for such an eventuality. Maybe the premium might go up a bit but the whole amount doesnt come from communities pocket.