thoro @ thoro @lemmy.ml

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Joined

5 yr. ago

Care to enlighten me on the other economic systems that have private property and a market economy?

The literal first two concrete policies in the opening paragraph of that article defining liberalism are private property and market economies.

Guess what the literal two defining features of capitalism are.

It was honestly a just a joke, and I'm not on Hexbear. Really wasn't that serious.

Feel free to take that one innocuous comment and use it as an example for further fragmentation of the platform though.

The civilized and good faith discussion that non Hexbear instances are oh so full of, folks.

I know. I'm being sarcastic.

Hey. Stop it.

Responding to accusations of being Nazis while literally being communists shows your brigading, debate provoking intentions.

but invade this discussion too.

Y'all.

We're on a federated platform.

If you want something to be instance specific, then say so.

Otherwise you're asking users to know to ignore posts that are literally on their feed on a platform whose whole entire purpose is inter-instance communication.

It's quite disingenuous to say defederating because of political differences.

Ironically a luxury that communist nations would not provide you with.

Ok, Jesus.

I'm on Lemmy.ml. 3 year old account.

If the post requested only instance users, I wouldn't have commented.

WTF.

Yes, there was a non aggression pact. I didn't deny that.

I'm agreeing they had a diplomatic relationship for a time, but that doesn't mean they shared ideological goals and both still considered the other to be geopolitical/ideological enemies.

The USSR actually first offered alliance with Britain and France against Nazi Germany..

That's the comparison to US/China relations where they have agreements and diplomatic relations, yet still obviously are ideologically and politically opposed to each other.

In the same way the US and China are "allied", sure.

There was a non aggression pact, but not sure that's really the same thing as being ideological or geopolitical "allies", and there is a A LOT of historical context surrounding that pact outside a high schooler's understanding of thinking they were best buds actually.

The USSR actually first offered alliance with Britain and France against Nazi Germany..

That's the comparison to US/China relations where they have agreements, yet still obviously are ideologically and politically opposed to each other.

As for them being mortal enemies, well the poem begins "First they came for the Communists" for a reason.

And then they literally went to war with each other.

That's not even getting into the fact that the USSR does not speak for all communism ever.

Edit: Wikipedia context, which obviously isn't even as good as historical accounts:

At the beginning of the 1930s, the Nazi Party's rise to power increased tensions between Germany and the Soviet Union, along with other countries with ethnic Slavs, who were considered "Untermenschen" (subhuman) according to Nazi racial ideology.[18] Moreover, the antisemitic Nazis associated ethnic Jews with both communism and financial capitalism, both of which they opposed.[19][20] Nazi theory held that Slavs in the Soviet Union were being ruled by "Jewish Bolshevik" masters.[21] Hitler had spoken of an inevitable battle for the acquisition of land for Germany in the east.[22] The resulting manifestation of German anti-Bolshevism and an increase in Soviet foreign debts caused a dramatic decline in German–Soviet trade.[c] Imports of Soviet goods to Germany fell to 223 million ℛ︁ℳ︁ in 1934 by the more isolationist Stalinist regime asserting power and by the abandonment of postwar Treaty of Versailles military controls, both of which decreased Germany's reliance on Soviet imports.[17][24][clarification needed]

In 1936, Germany and Fascist Italy supported the Spanish Nationalists in the Spanish Civil War, but the Soviets supported the Spanish Republic.[25] Thus, the Spanish Civil War became a proxy war between Germany and the Soviet Union.[26] In 1936, Germany and Japan entered the Anti-Comintern Pact,[27] and they were joined a year later by Italy.[28]

...

Hitler's fierce anti-Soviet rhetoric was one of the reasons that Britain and France decided that Soviet participation in the 1938 Munich Conference on Czechoslovakia would be both dangerous and useless.[30] In the Munich Agreement that followed[31] the conference agreed to a German annexation of part of Czechoslovakia in late 1938, but in early 1939 it had been completely dissolved.[32] The policy of appeasement toward Germany was conducted by the governments of British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain and French Prime Minister Édouard Daladier.[33] The policy immediately raised the question of whether the Soviet Union could avoid being next on Hitler's list.[34] The Soviet leadership believed that the West wanted to encourage German aggression in the East[35] and to stay neutral in a war initiated by Germany in the hope that Germany and the Soviet Union would wear each other out and put an end to both regimes.

The Soviet Union, which feared Western powers and the possibility of "capitalist encirclements", had little hope either of preventing war and wanted nothing less than an ironclad military alliance with France and Britain[51] to provide guaranteed support for a two-pronged attack on Germany.[52] Stalin's adherence to the collective security line was thus purely conditional.[53] Britain and France believed that war could still be avoided and that since the Soviet Union was so weakened by the Great Purge[54] that it could not be a main military participant.[52]

"One day before the military negotiations began, the Soviet Politburo pessimistically expected the coming negotiations to go nowhere and formally decided to consider German proposals seriously.[63] The military negotiations began on 12 August in Moscow, with a British delegation headed by the retired admiral Sir Reginald Drax, French delegation headed by General Aimé Doumenc and the Soviet delegation headed by Kliment Voroshilov, the commissar of defence, and Boris Shaposhnikov, chief of the general staff. Without written credentials, Drax was not authorised to guarantee anything to the Soviet Union and had been instructed by the British government to prolong the discussions as long as possible and to avoid answering the question of whether Poland would agree to permit Soviet troops to enter the country if the Germans invaded.[64]"

Almost like geopolitics is often more complicated than "akshually they definitely were aligned powers"

Well. For one, "It's a lie" is often shorthand for "it's a falsehood", so I'm not going to split hairs about whether it's a purposeful falsehood or not.

And secondly, how can you possibly mistakenly believe your experience improved with regard to Hexbear users when your instance never even federated with Hexbear? How can that possibly happen, where you experienced Hexbear users, had bad experiences, and then defederated leading to a better experience? When the instance never federated with Hexbear?

It just can't be true.

It's a lie. It's a falsehood. Whatever. It's not court. Tomato/tomato

They never had to deal with Hexbear because they never federated with Hexbear. It was pre-emptive so there's no way the experience "improved". There was never an "after Hexbear" on lemmy.world.

Think about this way: f they were acting this way while promoting fascism, you wouldn't even have a discussion post, you would just defederate.

Yes, because we all agree fascism is bad.

Because they claim to be communist and left-wing (though their actually still promoting fascism)

Ah, horseshoe BS.

No, there is a real, historical, and material difference between fascism and even the most "authoritarian" communist. Communists were literally the first people rounded up by the Nazis and are the mortal enemy of all fascists.

The instance, at worst, is vehemently opposed to capitalism and Western liberal capitalism, to the point many do support what they deem AES (actually existing socialist) states.

If you disagree with the role and actions of those states, fair enough. Hopefully, it's an informed disagreement that can withstand scrutiny.

Nonetheless, Hexbear's enemies are the capitalist class, the nations that most support modern neoliberal capitalism, and ,yes, obviously a distaste for those who support those ideals or nations online.

But you will not find homophobia, racism, transphobia, anti-feminism, master race rhetoric, anti-poor rhetoric, just world philosophy, etc that you absolutely would in a fascist community.

So I do not think it is correct to equate this instance, whatever your disagreements, with fascist instances like exploding heads that were making posts about how the female body exists for the male gaze and shit.

C'mon.

Even if they can be a little aggressive toward a "bad take", it's literally and even figuratively just not the same as 4chan.

The site wide joke is calling each other "libs", not homophobic/racist slurs.

"Good faith/bad faith" doesn't mean following the post topic to a tee or not. It's about sincerity.

And considering the reasoning of the OP lists interactions with Hexbear and "Kremlin propaganda", I don't see how it's off topic for those users to add additional context to those interactions and call out disagreements with the OP's description of the events.

The "bad faith" comment is not in any way uncivil or insincere.

OP is a Lib

The issue they brought up, Double Genocide Theory, is popular enough to have a Wikipedia page whose opening paragraph ends in "Double genocide theory has been criticized by scholars as a form of Holocaust trivialization."

The user has disagreements, but it's not a troll. It's very easy to spot the difference.

You seem to be on a crusade here for defederation.

The comment you're replying to isn't a troll. It's good faith engagement and criticism.

How is that possibly a "great example of why everyone should defederate from Hexbear"?

Aftersun.

Absolutely stunning and moving debut film.

Banshees, EEAAO, and Tar follow closely behind it, but that was so far the one that sticks with me most.

Still have a lot to watch from last year