shapis @ shapis @lemmy.ml

He/Him

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Joined

5 yr. ago

I personally dont understand why mass adoption is a goal.

Oh this one is easy. The higher market share the better software support they get.

And as a secondary bonus, the more people use it the more people contribute to it and make it even better. But mostly this one is just an extension of the first point.

It needs to "just work". It's not more complicated than that.

I linked it elsewhere. It's a problem if you install from the live image. If you want I could find the link again for ya.

It was still unfixed as of yesterday. That's how I found it out. I installed debian and was like huh. I can't update.

That's not it. If you install on your hardware with the live image. Apt upgrade is broken. On your hardware. Not on the live image.

Because you can't update your system at all. How's that not a problem?

I'm confused about this question.

If you install debian through the live image. The apt upgrade of your installation will come out of the box broken.

You are definitely doing something wrong.

Yes, installing through official media and doing sudo apt-get upgrade, the horror.

My suggestion would be to start with something stable like Debian

It's literally broken out of the box rn. The Debian live images are borked

If someone is using a stable distro like Debian, and just wants to do what 90% of people do (i.e. browsing, looking at documents media etc.), Linux isn’t really a hassle.

I see this point repeated a lot, it's just not true.

For example sudo apt upgrade is broken currently on the debian live images.

Imagine you tell someone "if you want stable, go debian" they hear it and install it and literally first apt update upgrade it's borked.

There isnt a distro that isnt a hassle, that doesnt exist.

I think the main issue with those is that flatpaks dont play nice with development tools, or cli tools.

If you use those you have to use container workarounds, which annoy some people, myself included.

That's more or less my experience too, my installation slowly breaks over time til I'm fed up and reinstall everything. Not sure what I'm even doing wrong if anything at all.

If you think that's the case. Check some big forums for each big distro right after a point update to read the tales of woe and breakage.

My personal experience with this has been:

Pop_OS broke after an update. Unrepairable as far as I could tell. And I tried hard. Happened to multiple.people there was a reddit thread about it.

Fedora broke on an update. Not sure if repairable. I didn't try. I had the most boring vanilla installation possible.

Arch has been unbootable twice over the years. And had to do many manual interventions. Both times it was fixable.

People are not lying to you when they say it breaks randomly. Just because it wasn't your personal experience doesn't mean it isn't a common experience. You just have been lucky so far.

well gnome software and epiphany app stores just work.

Man I wish I had time to boot up a vm with a big distro, open both stores and try to install something, it's immediately obvious.

There's a reason everyone online says "oh yeah, the stores exist, i still use the terminal though"

They do not work.

Your points are all entirely fair. It also surprises me how quite a few people don't get it.

And it's not that many requisites to fix it either.

A) don't break shit on updates. This is the worst thing that could happen.

B) There needs to be a clicky app store. Just one. No options. No pick your repos. No pick between flatpak and whatever else. Just a visual app store you click an app and it install. You click to remove it gets removed.

It's seriously not that much you'd think.

Having that said. If you do choose to endure through the learning curve. It's mostly worth it. But fuck. It's such a dumb self imposed learning curve.

Spend more time with my dad. I mean. I spent a ton. But I'd do it again.

He tried teaching me how to bbq and I never learned. And he was godtier at it. I'd learn this time.

Other that than duh lottery. Invest. Bitcoin the usual.

Flatpaks seaminglessly supporting all apps plus cli applications and drivers would be the holy grail.