matcha_addict @ matcha_addict @lemy.lol

Posts

59

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681

Joined

2 yr. ago

Imagine how things may go if Israel attempted to use Jews as human shields against Hamas.

You mean like putting many settlements and civilians right on the border of Gaza, a concentration camp and active war Zone? Or allowing a rave dance to occur at the gates of a concentration camp and active war zone, and next to a military base that would be targeted by Hamas? And sprinkle in some IDF tanks while you're at it.

Wait, we don't have to imagine it.

"The genocide must stop" is what you consider to be terrorism? Oh yeah, you must be from the west, where terrorism is resisting massacre.

makes me care less

What has your hesitant caring (if even true) achieved before? Is there anything lost that we should worry about?

We actually much rather you take a step back and leave us. Please start by telling your governments to gtfo of Middle east and stop all intervention. We don't want you.

I hope more of you fake nuanced people go back to Reddit.

"bro please bro it's complicated bro you can't oppose apartheid bro have you not considered it's complicated bro? Please bro you have to maintain status quo"

Nope. It began in late 19th century at the earliest.

Hamas wanted to kill as many citizens of Israel as possible

Source?

This is false. Hamas is not free of criticism, they did commit needless killing of civilians, but their main target remains the IDF. This is contrasted with Israel, whose target is civilians.

Even the music festival was located right next to the Re'im base. The festival itself had Israeli gunned men and tanks. Again, I do not condemn the civilians needlessly killed by some Hamas members, but the operation's target was the military.

I would not equate the too. Not to mention, Israel sponsored Hamas.

I have a solution for you: why shouldn't we live with Israelis in peace? Why can't we have a Democratic state for all? Israel loses this "historical land" battle, but even if they didn't, does that justify massacre? Palestinians have always advocated a state for all, but Israel never agrees.

I agree with you that it needs to be clarified further. While I think it is still "resistance" in the sense that it was done with the intention to resist occupation and all what Israel does, I do agree that civilians died that didn't need to, and it did not lead to positive results.

When you live your whole life in a concentration camp and get bombed almost daily, you may lose some rationality and start justifying more things in the name or resistance. Ultimately I blame Israel for putting them in this situation, and putting civilians so close to their border.

In the end, my whole point is that Hamas attack must not justify a response from Israel. It should lead us to pull back instead.

Hamas seems to have developed a home-grown rocket manufacturing capability

That exactly tells you why it's so imprecise. Israel has weapons created by the world's top rocket scientists and the most precise manufacturing facilities, and for Hamas it's people who barely have couple hours of electricity per day putting something together in one of the most densely populated areas, full of rubble and destruction.

When I say they "target" military facilities, I mean that's what they aim for. Not that they have the high military capabilities to never miss.

Moreover, Hamas has, in recent days, specifically targeted Israeli civilians

I don't deny that there are individuals in Hamas who have targeted civilians or killed them needlessly. Hamas is a resistance militia and not a hive mind. Unfortunately, living your entire life in a concentration camp with limited food and electricity, watching families burning alive and buildings coming down may lead you to hate people who are rave dancing on the gates of your open air prison, or even the regular civilians. It is not rational, but it is bound to happen. And because of this, I blame Israel.

And I don't blame Israel to absolve Hamas of blame. Hamas leadership is complicit in ignoring civilian killing, I do not deny this. But blaming Hamas will drive no significant change. The root cause of these issues is Israel. At the very least, the civilian killings are usually individual actions, and Hamas' military campaigns target the military. Whereas for Israel, civilians are target, and Hamas is their tool to convince Israelis that bombing Gaza is good.

The comment I linked to you in response to a comment making the same claims you're making. All of your points should be addressed in the comment I linked. Is there any part of the comment I linked you that you think is incorrect? Or is there something you think I left unaddressed? Please let me know.

It seems like Hamas revised some of the more objectionable language in the original

It's a quite big change, not mere paraphrasing or slight changes if that's what you're implying. Hamas changed radically in that time, as I explained in the comment I linked, and the document reflects that.

but they are still Hamas, and their intentions are quite clear both by word and deed.

Intentions of what? Do you mean your original claim above? Again, I already talked about why that's false. It would be easier if you address my argument instead of make the same claims again. The only genocidal entity by word and deed at the moment is Israel.

They absolutely do. Their goal is ethnic cleansing. Every Israeli policy is about forcing Palestinians outside of Palestine. Why else are most Palestinians never allowed to come back if they leave, or given hell for it in the minority cases that they are?

You can absolutely verify a civilian. Are you kidding me?!! You guys will say anything to justify keeping people in a concentrstjon camp. I can't believe the degree of heartlessness.

What good does a warning do?

Hey, I'm about to obliterate your neighborhood in 12 hours. Get ready.

Gee thanks, don't know what I would've done. Now I'm sure you'll at least let me seek refuge in the territories you occupy, Israel, right? Right?!!

Hamas missiles target military installations, not civilians. Israel has the modern weaponry to only target the militants, whereas Hamas doesn't. Yet Israel's casualties have magnitudes more of civilians than Hamas, despite their imprecise weapons.

Israel does not allow Gaza civilians to leave Gaza. Why blame Hamas?

Israel is an apartheid state. Hamas is a resistance against it.

Also nice avoiding the question. I never expected an answer from you anyways.

I take it you don't understand what "directly" means. Not surprising.

You didn't have to draw anything to let me know that you can't state your argument directly. I already suspected.

It is the exact opposite. Israel continuously brutalizes even Palestinian civilians in their own territories, without any military supporting them whatsoever.

https://www.savethechildren.net/news/%E2%80%9Ctreated-animals%E2%80%9D-palestinian-children-face-inhumane-treatment-israeli-run-prisons

https://www.savethechildren.net/news/stripped-beaten-and-blindfolded-new-research-reveals-ongoing-violence-and-abuse-palestinian

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/05/palestinian-boy-mohammed-abu-khdeir-burned-alive

https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/how-israel-protects-its-settlers-who-burn-palestinian-children-alive

https://www.timesofisrael.com/ending-censorship-idf-admits-officer-jailed-in-2017-raped-a-palestinian-woman/

https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/editorial/2023-09-05/ty-article-opinion/israels-humiliating-practice-of-strip-searching-palestinian-women/0000018a-61b0-daa9-a78f-efb765a30000

The soundness of your argument should not depend on your stance. It is a common tactic to state that you are "pro-X" but criticize X, because people are more likely to sympathize with your criticism that way. The commenter you replied to is simply reminding us of this.