lemmeee @ lemmeee @sh.itjust.works

Posts

2

Comments

185

Joined

1 yr. ago

It's certainly great that you can install any distro with mainline kernel on the deck (even if some things don't work). But my point was that Valve doesn't care about user freedom. Their OS and the Steam client are proprietary. If they made a GNU/Linux phone, there is no guarantee that you would be able to install a free distro and it almost certainly would come with non free software by default, which would be bad.

Would love to see an open phone you can easily run your own distribution on without jumping through hoops.

I think PinePhone Pro and Librem 5 can run a mainline kernel. It's possible that some things won't work, but a lot of stuff has been upstreamed. I'm curious if you can easily install an ARM build of Debian on them, but couldn't find any information last time I looked it up.

But phones are hard. An x86 phone with decent battery life is even harder. But one can dream.

Oh yeah, that is the dream. I wonder how are the current mobile Ryzen CPUs. I'm curious if there is any that could work well in a phone.

Not all Linux distributions use GNU.

Almost all popular ones do.

I daily drive mine and it's not good, but I prefer that than running spyware.

GNU-like Linux

PinePhone and Librem 5 actually run GNU/Linux. Same software that you can run on desktop. Only Ubuntu Touch uses Android kernel I think.

But it's not the same Linux kernel that we use on desktop.

I daily drive mine and haven't noticed any missed calls, but maybe I'm just lucky or it's the Pro version that has the issue. The battery life can be increased with extended cases, but the performance will always suck and there are lots of annoying software issues too.

Can't do anything about the camera, but there are extended battery cases that you can get. I got the keyboard addon with the battery and that helps, but it's also pretty big and heavy.

Here is a recent blog post about someone's experience with PinePhone Pro: https://zerwuerfnis.org/daily-driving-the-pinephone-pro

I have the original PinePhone and it seems to have less issues, but it's also slower and has a crappy camera.

I believe you, but the hard part about “It was good enough for me” is that an old Nokia brick phone is “good enough” for some people.

The main difference is that the old Nokia phone runs proprietary software. You also can't run any desktop programs or apps on it. But PinePhone requires GNU/Linux experience and sometimes workarounds are needed.

The “official” state of the software from pine64.org itself states the modem crashes often and results in missed calls

I haven't noticed any missed calls on my original PinePhone, so this is surprising. I don't have the Pro version to check, but the cited bug report is a year old, so it might be no longer the case. On the other hand, this recent blog post says there are some issues with the modem and some other strange bugs. That would be a shame, because it's been 2 years since its release and I was hoping to switch to it at some point.

camera still a WIP

I think there is only one guy working on the software. Here is his last blog post, if you are curious: https://blog.brixit.nl/fixing-the-megapixels-sensor-linearization/

no push notifications when the phone sleeps (so the phone just never sleeps, thus the terrible battery, i presume).

There are no push notifications. So you won't be notified when you receive a message in some app, while the phone is suspended. As a workaround you can use a script to wake the phone up periodically. Short battery life is caused by an old and inefficient SoC, not by software, so there is nothing we can do about that other than getting a bigger case and a bigger battery (some people do that).

2 years is a lot of time. Things have changed a lot since then. The community and Purism are the ones developing the software. Pine64 has nothing to do with it.

Out of all the things you just mentioned, Signal is the only one that won't work, because it requires an Android/iOS app. You can't use it on desktop by itself either. But you could try running the Android version with Waydroid. I use Matrix instead.

Phosh is pretty good. I don't think Gnome Mobile is finished yet.

In the US store it costs 200$ for the original PinePhone and 400$ for the Pro version. The EU store is a little more expensive.

I'm not the person you asked, but I've had mine for 2 years.

Pros:

• free software and freedom (and with that increased privacy and security)
• runs the same software that you can run on desktop as long as it has an ARM build (a lot of Debian packages do) or you compile it yourself - this includes not just apps, but also terminal programs and servers
• killswitch to power off the proprietary modem for when you don't want phone carrier tracking you
• like in other modern phones the modem is isolated (here it's connected over USB)
• multiple distros to choose from
• multiple desktop environments to choose from
• replacable battery
• headphone jack
• replacement parts available in case you break something
• there are some interesting addons that you can buy (https://pine64.org/devices/pinephone/#accessories)
• microSD card slot
• you can boot from the microSD card, so distro hopping is easy
• can run Android apps through Waydroid

Cons:

• slow - you are running modern software on an old SoC (the Pro version is faster, but still slow compared to modern phones)
• not all GNU/Linux apps have a responsive UI that works well on mobile
• some old apps might not have touch support
• short battery life - the SoC is not very energy efficient. Possible workarounds: get the keyboard addon with builtin battery (but it makes the phone bigger and heavier), carry spare batteries with you, or buy/3D print a bigger case and use a bigger battery
• runs hot
• GPS isn't super accurate
• audio quality during phone calls isn't great
• the non-pro version might not be able to run a mainline kernel, so you might not be able to install a desktop distro on it
• the Pro version should be able to run a mainline kernel, but there might be things that don't work
• experience with GNU/Linux is required
• sometimes workarounds are needed - for me, on Mobian stable sometimes the modem or wifi don't wake up from suspend and I have to reset it with a script (I added it to the apps menu for quick access, but it's still annoying)
• [on original PinePhone] bad camera and the default app can only take pictures - there is a script for recording video, but then there is no preview
• I'm not sure if you can use the camera as a webcam in most software
• [might depend on the model] video playback is not GPU accelerated, so it makes the CPU hot and drains battery and you might be limited to 1080p@30fps or 720p
• you can run a stable distro with old software and old bugs (and sometimes things change very fast) or a less stable one with current software, but then things will sometimes break after update and you will have to fix it (probably more than on desktop)
• on Mobian stable (old software) the proximity sensor acts weird during a call and sometimes you can't see the screen
• no Xbox gamepad support in Mobian stable (but Playstation gamepads work)
• they keyboard addon isn't perfect and requires some setup
• with the keyboard addon I can't plug in any USB devices to the phone and I don't know why - charging works though
• support for emergency broadcast is only just now being introduced in Phosh (https://phosh.mobi/posts/cellbroadcast)
• [original PinePhone] uses micro SIM standard instead of nano SIM
• sometimes there is screen flickering in non-pro version
• killswitches could be a bit easier to flip (they are very small)
• [on original PinePhone] poor 3D performance (even SuperTuxKart doesn't run smoothly), WebGL doesn't seem to work (at least for 3D)
• not a lot of RAM, so you can't run too many apps at once or have too many browser tabs open - you can still run Electron apps, though (just not too many at once)
• no push notifications, so if you want to be notified when you get a message in some app, while the phone is suspended, you would have to setup a script to wake the phone up periodically

Edit: I corrected a mistake with the SIM card. I turns out that PinePhone Pro uses nano SIM and it's only the original PinePhone that uses micro SIM

You can run any GNU/Linux program on it as long as it has an ARM build (a lot of them do) or you compile it for ARM. There is also the keyboard addon (https://pine64.org/documentation/Phone_Accessories/Keyboard/), but it makes the phone bigger.

GNU is a recursive acronym for "GNU's Not Unix!",[6][12] chosen because GNU's design is Unix-like, but differs from Unix by being free software and containing no Unix code.[6][13][14] Stallman chose the name by using various plays on words, including the song The Gnu.[4]: 45:30 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU

Exactly. Even in this community and in this post people keep mixing Linux, GNU/Linux and Android. It's crazy that even people who use this operating system are confused. Almost always when they say Linux they really mean GNU/Linux. Linux Mint or Arch Linux are GNU/Linux. But Android isn't and it doesn't even use the mainline Linux kernel.

The issue of freedom is a separate thing, because even most GNU/Linux distros contain proprietary software just like Android.

Oh, I thought they used a way older one. If it's current LTS, then it's not old at all.

Wow, that sounds complicated. But I'm curious if your keycaps would work better for typing than the default ones.

Steam OS is proprietary.

But Arch contains proprietary firmware, so technically it's not fully free software either.

Same, on desktop and mobile. I don't know if it's funny or sad that a community called "linuxmemes" can't tell the difference between Linux, GNU/Linux and Android.

I can confirm that my PinePhone runs the same software that I run on my desktop. I usually don't even need to compile anything, since a lot of packages in Debian repo have an ARM version. Not all apps have responsive UIs and some of the old ones lack touch support, though. But that is something that keeps improving over time (GNOME 4 and libhandy for example). You can also use CLI programs if you want.