Victoria Antoinette @ VictoriaAScharleau @lemmy.world

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1 yr. ago

no one is raping cows

You may as well reply to me by saying “but your arguments are moot because reason doesn’t dictate my behavior”

that is essentially what i'm saying. farmers are no more rational than i am. neither are abbatoir owers or their workers or meat packers or food suppliers or grocers or restauranteurs. your reasoning would hold up if they were rational actors, but they are not, so you argument crumbles.

I wonder if you actually read that page, particularly the part that says people don't even know what gives them the most utility and when it seems to be calculable they still make irrational choices.

your math doesn't dictate behavior.

you statistics don't save chickens, either.

they can't know that. knowledge is a justified true belief. since the future has not happened, it has no truth value, and, as such, future knowledge is impossible. they do not know whether i will purchase meat in the future. qed

Your argument makes hiring hitmen permissible so long as there’s at least one middle man.

no, it doesn't. actively contracting a future action is completely disanalogous with buying a product on a shelf.

buying meat today can't have caused an animal in the past to be killed, since an event in the future cannot cause an event in the past.

you'll forgive me if, in turn, i think your values are "fucked up."

thats a lot of words for "no fewer chickens were raised any year than the year before since we started tracking it."

The guy wouldn’t have paid the guy if you weren’t going to pay him.

i have no agreement to purchase meat in the future. most people don't.

you pay the guy who pays the guy who kills the animals

most people don't do that, either. meat packers will get it from the abattoirs, who will then sell it to suppliers, and there might be two or three suppliers before anyone sells it to a grocer or restaurant.

the animal isn't killed because i create demand, except for meanings of "cause" that don't require a causal relationship.

oh you’re a troll.

calling me names doesn't change the truth of what i said

Buying meat is paying for animals to be killed

no, it's not. there are people who kill animals, and there are people who pay them, and most people are neither.

Would you refuse to save a child from poverty on the grounds that billions will continue living in poverty?

this is a terrible analogy because at the end of one, you can point to the person being saved. no animals are saved by eating plants.

go vegan and prevent a dozen cows from being raised and killed for meat

which farms raised fewer cattle last year?

We slit the throats of 90 billion land animals each year.

well stop doing that.

paying for animals to be killed

almost no one does that.

lets see if i can help you:

knowledge is a justified, true belief. if you disbelieve something you can't "know it". similarly, if your justification is insufficient, you can't know it. finally, if it actually isn't true (which would be a good reason it lacks justification), you also can't know it.

i can't help with the depression but i might be able to help alleviate the guilt. is there some particular fact that you think is the crux of it all, which, if you didn't believe it, or found your justification was insufficient, or just that it's not true, you would be happier? i'm pretty good at evaluating positive claims and determining whether they are rational.

I'd rather be happy

vystopia isnt any fun either