Value Subtracted @ ValueSubtracted @startrek.website

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The headline has since been changed:

Trudeau to fill Senate vacancies before retiring: source

we didn’t really learn much more about her than we already knew.

Yeah. I said in my original comment that the Georgiou storyline is the strongest one, but it still feels very much like the first chapter that sets up future development, rather than something that pushed her story very far forward. It basically positions her as realizing that maybe a "monster with a conscience" isn't so useless after all, and that she can work to atone for her past misdeeds.

Which is fine...but it's still a setup for future stories that may never happen. It very much feels like a series pilot, rather than a standalone movie.

I completely agree with all of the other stuff you mention about the other characters, and I think it just screams, "we tried to compress an entire season's worth of story into a single movie." A lot of stuff happens, but everything that would get us invested in the characters was cut.

The Fuzz reveal makes a lot more sense if if happens in, say, episode 7 out of 10.

But that being said, we can see Starbase 17 (two of them, in different locations!), Starbase 25 and Deep Space 3 across the treaty line

It's a very confusing graphic, but I think the line might intead represent the area of space in which Alok's team operates - it starts to animate as "Alpha Squad" is highlighted amongst the list of available S31 squads. But it certainly looks like a border, so it's ambiguous, at best. The entire sequence is also questionable, considering it contains "footage" of Georgiou in the 32nd Century.

This is a TOS-style stardate, but back then stardates were pretty much random, and given the state of stardates these days, tells us absolutely nothing about when this is set

At least one online Stardate calculator spits out a result of April 17, 2324, which sounds about right based on Garrett's age. I have no idea what formula is being applied to get that result, though.

While civil unrest and secession from the Federation would lead to chaos and Tasha escaping from the colony around 2353, that collapse wouldn’t start until around 2339.

A barely-related sidenote: I firmly believe that Turkana IV was an independent human colony, and never a Federation member. In "Legacy," Picard says that the planet "severed relations" with the Federation, which doesn't necessarily mean they seceded (and, really, the word "seceded" was right there for them to use). This would also help explain why the Federation allowed the planetary government to collapse the way that it did, with no apparent intervention.

I would be happy to see these characters again, under a different writer/director team.

I think I liked it more than you did, but there are few criticisms I've seen that I don't agree with. Enjoying it does not necessarily equate with thinking it was good, you know?

I'm hearing that she may have come aboard at Michelle Yeoh's request.

I've always thought that the Terran Empire is inherently abusive, and that Georgiou is best used as the ultimate nature vs. nurture case study.

In that sense, I was glad to see some aspects of her younger life explored. I find this "Hunger Games"-esque concept at least more interesting than the "revenge-seeking ex-lover" part of it, which was a lot less compelling to me.

I'm guessing that this is something they do if the previous emperor dies of natural causes or willingly abdicates.

I can't remember how many candidates they said there were, but I assume each one is sponsored by some kind of nobility within the Empire.

With both The Hunger Games and the Terrans being inspired by the Roman Empire, I didn't think it was entirely out of left field (with the caveat that the Mirror Universe is a very silly place).

Who was that hologram lady supposed to be at the end? She looks vaguely familiar but I couldn’t place her.

That was, unexpectedly, the legendary Jamie Lee Curtis.

LOL my guess - and it's only a guess - is that this is what happens when the previous Emperor either dies or abdicates willingly.

Which would make it maybe the seventh most ridiculous thing about the Terran Empire.

Okay, I enjoyed it as a breezy action movie.

I had a goofy grin on my face for much of the first act - it had style, which sort of fell away over time, which was unfortunate.

The Georgiou story is by far the strongest aspect of the movie - long-lost lover seeking revenge isn't the most original of plots, but it's executed well enough, and Michelle Yeoh is pretty terrific as expected. I particularly liked her line about a monster with a conscience being useless.

The middle act probably should have been simplified. The mole storyline was a distraction that prevented us from getting to know the new characters, and every single one of them suffers for it. Garrett's storyline needed more meat, and I would have appreciated more time spent with Alok beyond just the exposition of his backstory. Quasi skates by on Sam Richardson's considerable charm alone.

All in all, I think the movie is worth the time, even if no one's going to call it "deep" any time soon. I'd certainly be interested in watching them go to Turkana IV.

RIP Zeph. You were too beautiful for this world.

I appreciate the long answer - this is supposed to be a space for discussion!

I appreciate your perspective, too - I think if there's a difference in our perspectives, it might be that I prefer to see aspiration through struggle. The TNG "sunny ways" were fine for its time, but I think it's more meaningful - especially in the times we're living through - to portray the eternal vigilance and struggle to get to the Federation "utopia" (I kind of hate that word, but you know what I mean) - and to maintain it once you've got it.

It's interesting - I guess in my mind, the stuff SNW is doing is about as close to "traditional" Star Trek as it's possible to get in the current landscape. What do you feel is missing?

I haven't liked everything to come out of this era, but on balance I think Kurtzman has done a very good job with the franchise. One streaming movie that's a bit of a dud (assuming I don't like it when I actually see it) isn't likely to change my opinion on that.

The Verge: Star Trek: Section 31 is firing on all cylinders

Go on...

To be honest, that's always been the core argument.

I don't know where the line is - obviously, the morphogenic virus in DS9 was beyond the pale, but is it wise to expect hostile neighbours to be won over by sunshine and rainbows?

We have a thread set up to collect advance reviews - please feel free to share this there.

TrekMovie: Early Thoughts On ‘Star Trek: Section 31’

TrekCore: Star Trek: Section 31 Is a Dreary, Unfortunate Misfire

io9: Section 31 Is a Mediocre Action Movie, and an Even Worse Star Trek One

The Federation didn’t need 31 to win the war

Do we know that for certain? The cure to the virus was actually pretty fundamental to the Female Changeling ordering the Jem'Hadar to stand down. She refused to surrender until Odo linked with her and cured her.