RoundSparrow @ RoundSparrow @lemmy.ml

"Finnegans Wake is the greatest guidebook to media study ever fashioned by

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2 yr. ago

Right now lemmy backend only supports a single 'subscribed' list, that would be like a music player only having a single playlist. I know people are using multiple logins just to have more flexibility in managing their lists.

This basically shuts my idea down

it's not very difficult to modify the code for something like this.... and closing off registration wont' let anyone else login and create new content form your istance.

Personally the load on the major servers by having one more instance that subscribes to everything is why I think people should back off from creating more than the 1500 instances Lemmy network already has. Delivery of every single vote, comment, post 24 hours a day just so one person can read content for an hour or two a day.

That makes sense for email systems where all that content doesn't have to be sent, but for Lemmy it's a huge amount of overhead.

ok, I'm going to delete this post. People actually aren't discussing privacy and are just debating if they think Lemmy needs Multi-Reddit. And I just want to get the code finished. I am probably moving ahead on the code with ZERO sharing of any existing data.

dismissing client-side techniques as nonsense without seeming to understand why they were being discussed in the first place.

I'm the one who started a post about a server-side solution that entirely is based on Reddit's code for a server-side solution. YOU are the one coming along with this wild idea that a server change isn't needed at all. yet, you have not demonstrated this wild claim you made!

I’m not interested in any multireddit feature that reduces sub privacy. I’d consider it a net loss for lemmy.

It does NOT require it. I will repeat it: IT IS NOT REQUIRED! It is a sub-feature that facilities better openness that I am suggesting be added as part of the core feature I'm developing.

On Reddit, multi-reddits personal in nature.

10 years ago Reddit announced it as entirely not being personal! That sharing them was the whole point. I again question if you even understand what multi-reddit is!

shouldn’t require relaxing privacy constraints in any case.

It isn't at all essential to the feature.

I have already coded it so that it does NOT require sharing of anyone's data, at all. No way shape or form. I'm proposing it as a discussion topic because it's easy to implement and goes along with the whole spirit of a public forum where people share their public stuff. That people might actually want an easy way to help others out...

But, it's easier for me just to avoid any privacy topic entirely and not allow sharing of anything. Just build the whole design with opt-in only empty list.

I’m suggesting that multireddits are a “local” function. Theu are so local that they’re possible without server-side support at all,

Again, how? If I want a blend of 50 different communities, how can Reddit or Lemmy do that without 50 API calls if you do not add server-side MultiReddit code?

50 API calls is the overhead and nonsense that is being avoided here....

It could also be a filtered view based on the subscribed/all feed which provides a single API call that can return material from multiple communities.

"that can return material from multiple communities" - that's exactly how Reddit does multi-reddit, what feature do you think multi-reddit is?

But it should definitely be off by default and have a clear warning when you try to enable it.

I was afraid people would say that. The easier way is to just not touch it at all, as adding new code to opt in/opt out is more Rust code programming that is in rare supply with developers.

The easiest solution is to avoid it and not introduce sharing of personal communities at all. Which was what I was afraid this discussion would yield. So we start fresh with empty MultiPass lists and build them up from scratch.]

the amount of low-effort drive by comments and off-topic posts communities gets just because they are similarly named is bad enough as it is.

which is why I actually want it.

I think a well-cultivated list of quality communities that people share is a means to escape the heavy amount of noise that grew out of the explosion in the number of low-effort barely-any-moderation instances.

Another way to look at this feature is really simple: multiple subscribe lists, the ability to organize what you subscribe to into your cultivated groups. I don't see why anyone thinks a limitation of having only one community list per login is beneficial in organizing the duplicate choices all over the place.

why does a multi-reddit need multiple instances to collaborate to create the feed?

by "create the feed", I assume you mean "provide posts" when API call post/list is called?

content is replicated in all federated instances. You only need to use the local copy and merge all the communities of the multi-reddit.

Yes, that is what MultiPass would do, query the local PostgreSQL database. Right now Lemmy only allows this for a single Subscribe/Follow list per user... you have to create 3 different logins if you want 3 different lists of communities. For example, a "games" list, "music" list, "news" list.... Plus, the current design does not accommodate logged-out users, they have no way to list multiple communities (other than "All", local or merged remote+local).

Multi-reddits as they exist on Reddit itself could be implemented entirely client-side, the server side stuff just syncs the behavior of multiple client apps.

Can you explain how? As the only way I can see this is if you did 50 different API requests for all 50 subreddits, merged the results, and then sorted them again by the desired order.

Why does the concept of a multi-reddit need to extend outside of the user’s instance?

it doesn't need to. But why would you not want it when communities are multi-instance?

perhaps I made a mistake introducing the privacy concern first. As now the whole topic seems to negate the very reason so many people have requested MultiReddit on Lemmy. The privacy issue isn't even essential, I just wanted to have a discussion about it as a general topic. I'm already building the code so that it can be done entirely without anyone sharing their personal subscribed list.

Recently I’ve noticed my feed has become almost entirely the main meme instance. The algorithm gives me 4 meme posts then a technology post then load more memes

Yes, same issue, and I'm using lemmy-ui...

Lemmy's backend Top/Active/Hot are pretty primitive. I'm experimenting with some ways to weigh smaller less-popular communities... because +20 vote on meme topics is noise, but +20 on some focused community can be a big deal. hot_rank doesn't take that into account and just looks at published date and score. It's pretty tricky to get new things into the backend, so it may be a while.

I wouldn't trust that assumption, goarmy.com

Personally I think the issue is more that there is blind loyalty to team sports in USA culture, and no matter how many bad things are documented about a specific person (Donald Trump, Richard Nixon)... people are loyal to the image of that person, the brand and logo. People are raised in the USA to be inundated with breakfast cereal and toy company logo/brand recognition. It's a faith system. Breakfast cereals and fast-food "Happy plates" that fund a lot of children's TV are incredibly unhealthy and profit machines - and parents think this is psychologically healthy.

Politics will eventually be replaced by imagery. The politician will be only too happy to abdicate in favor of his image, because the image will be much more powerful than he could ever be. -Marshall McLuhan

I'll say this: a lot of discussion seems to take place on Matrix chat that doesn't make it into GitHub code comments as to why specific changes are made.

It used to be you could see the actual content of deleted comments and it was at the discretion of the client to show or not show them. The newcomers from Reddit (June) seemed to not like that people could read content of deleted comments, so I think changes were made for that reason.

With federation, it really isn't reasonable to expect content copies to all be deleted. So it's a complex issue.

With 0.18.2, 0.18.3 there were changes in the behavior of comment sorting and delete / remove behavior. It is entirely possible that behavior changed, intentional or otherwise.

There is a !test@lemmy.ml community where you could create comments, do some screen shots before and after delete.

An Instance is just another word for 'server' in lemmy terminology. HDTV is a classic form of media that doesn't involve TCP/IP to watch films and other video content.

If everyone was spread out onto different instances

Each instance with an owner/operator making rules... that the average social media user walks in, orders a drink, and starts smoking without any concern that neither one may be allowed. People can be loyal to their media outlets even when it is beyond obvious they are bad. People raised on storybooks that endorse bad behaviors and values, HDTV networks, and social media too. Audience desire to "react comment" to images and not actually read what others have commented - nor learn about the venue operators and reasons for rules is pretty much the baseline experience in 2023.

When it comes to media attraction, what they call themselves (labels) don't really matter that much. It's the praise of strong men, authority, that crosses all mythological media systems. Be it bowing down to a burning bush story, Fox News, or Kremlin.