PoliticalAgitator @ PoliticalAgitator @lemm.ee

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2 yr. ago

A full ban on semi-automatic weapons. Thanks for your support.

Why stop at drugs? If we're binning laws because people do them anyway, we can legalise rape, murder, DUI, even child slavery.

But maybe don't give them any ideas -- gun sales would sky-rocket and ultimately most pro-gun people are just simps to corporate interests.

How are the gun violence stats looking after 25 years of the pro-gun community insisting they have the solutions?

Should we plot them on a chart next to the profitability of the gun manufacturers?

Maybe your next solution could focus on tracking down that magic gun fairy that keeps giving guns to criminals, since they're definitely not being supplied and enabled by responsible gun owners like yourself.

Do you want more unmedicated people with guns?

If they wanted that, they'd do things like oppose red flag laws, insist background checks remained functionally optional, oppose effective waiting periods and oppose mandatory safe storage laws.

People with mental health issues wouldn't ever seek care if owning a firearm was linked to healthcare.

Is "some people care more about their guns than the safety and mental health of themselves and their family" supposed to be an argument for the existing gun laws?

Now we're stigmatizing mental health treatment.

Who exactly is "we" here?

The pro-gun community rushes to blame anyone but themselves, all the while seething with indignation that they get lumped in with people who murder their partners or kill as many children as they can, just because they bought the same guns, from the same stores, under the same systems, with the same requirements as the murderer.

But boy they're not shy doing unto others.

Half the world population will experience mental health problems in their lifetime. If the 80% of mass murderers using legally purchased guns is a low enough figure to sweep under the rug, the fraction of a fraction of mentally ill people carrying out mass murders isn't even a speck of dust.

This man received urgent mental healthcare, to the standard that modern healthcare can provide anywhere in the world. Then he killed 20 people and injured over a dozen more with his legal firearm.

If you're so certain that mental healthcare is the answer, you can give up your guns until you finish building your perfect healthcare utopia. Maybe you could start with the military, since apparently you have to be mentally ill to kill someone with a gun.

Until then, the current gun laws are horrifically and demonstrably inadequate at keeping guns out of the hands of violent people, despite 25 years of pro-gun cultists insisting that they and they alone have the solutions.

Are you sure you're not confusing him with the previous mass shooter in Maine from 6 months ago?

I know they're hard to keep track of when they happen every month but as far as I've been able to tell, 2 days ago this man was a "responsible gun owner" who wasn't disarmed using the red flags laws (that the pro-gun crowd opposes) despite seeking urgent treatment for mental health problems (which the pro-gun crowd insists is the solution).

I've already agreed to ban handguns too so don't feel obligated to post statistics that were next to the statistics I actually challenged.

You plan on taking them? Tell me exactly what makes you think those who have them illegally will turn them in and what makes you think LEOs will be willing to go door to door taking guns?

I'm fine with "responsible gun owners" becoming "illegal gun owners". If they're caught with illegal firearms, they get charged with possession just like anybody else.

They will have had their chance to comply with democratically decided gun laws and if they can't prove they are able to securely store and responsibly handle, fuck em.

I'm also fine with firing police who selectively uphold the law based on their own shitty personal views, just as I'm fine with taking away the excuses they use to execute people on the spot.

Domestic abuse is also in that list but it's not as high as gang and drug violence...also go fuck yourself you race baiting shit.

In 2007, 14% of homicides were domestic violence related.

In 2020, 9.7% of homicides were gang related.

So what a surprise, you're just pushing right-wing "it's those urban kids and their gangs" pro-gun talking points for Fox News hairpieces.

Armed minorities are harder to oppress and I'm not the white picket fence urbanized white kid who wants to disarm minorities.

Are they? Because they're looking pretty fucking oppressed to me.

Police in America routinely execute black people on the street and in their homes. If those victims were in 50ft of a gun, they don't do even a token investigation.

Black men are incarcerated at a much higher rate and in a country where incarceration is already far beyond countries of comparable wealth. Once there, they're used as slave labor for multi-million dollar companies.

And of course, every few months a far-right extremist takes their legal gun and goes hunting minorities, targeting places like majority black churches or gay clubs, killing as many of them as they possibly can before the police arrive with their hamburger.

By all means, share with us exactly when we're supposed to start firing on police and how you expect that to lead to systemic reform and not just minorities being killed with a renewed vigor.

You can't though can you? Because "armed minorities are harder to oppress" isn't actually wisdom. It's not based on anything at all.

It's a marketing slogan invented by the gun lobby and taught to suckers with no purpose other than increasing gun sales beyond the usual "middle aged white conservative" demographic, in order to funnel more blood money into their offshore accounts.

Yes it would be good to get single payer healthcare and it would be good to rebuild our mental healthcare in the USA. It would be good to end the drug war, and end for profit prisons. It would be good to pay teachers more and to focus more money on our inner city schools instead of white suburban schools.

Is this actually related to anything in this conversation or are you just trying reassure everybody you're definitely a progressive because leftists like cool guns too, get your cool gun now, AR-15s on sale now just $499, armed minorities are harder to oppress, better to have one and not need it, better still to have two or three and not need them, save $200 when you purchase two or more guns.

Got any other silly comments?

Got any more marketing slogans you want to get off your chest? Maybe you could lie about some more statistics?

PS, you're not arguing with a white christian republican....

Sure I am. Whatever color your skin may be, inside that skull are the exact thoughts of a white christian republican -- and that's not something you can lie about.

Oh did you solve racism with your cool guns? Did you stop state violence?

Nope, of course you didn't. You're full of shit like always and minorities are safer in countries with gun control.

Just another day of the pro-gun crowd delivering on zero of their promises.

Not as clearly as you seem to think. You'll struggle to find qualified people with criticism of their response.

He was trying to shame Twitter for deplatforming far-right extremists by swinging his dick around and then his lawyers informed him he could either lose billions on the purchase or billions on the lawsuit.

Nah, that doesn't sound like you. You'd find an article about people being maimed by faulty Ryobi drills and comment "Honestly it's not that hard to use a drill if you're as smart and well hung as I am. I've used my Fesstool cordless drill three times now and was fine every time" like a smug fuck.

News networks profit from covering mass shootings. Mass shooting coverage sells more guns which is profitable for the gun lobby. More guns sold means more mass shootings.

It's the circle of "profiting off innocent peoples deaths"

Yeah! I mean look at this former responsible gun owner in Maine! He has a AR-15 and is clearly very good at killing innocent people.

So they're not just for morbidly obese middle-aged men, with neither combat training nor the discipline to undertake it, to parade around with in a poorly articulated tantrum about masks, posing at a sloppy attention for the Fox News cameras.

The only thing these damn gun-grabbers seem to know about guns is how many innocent people they kill and how seldom they deliver on their promises.

It's not really as complex as people make out.

The gun lobby profits from gun sales. Mass shootings increase gun sales, which in turn increase mass shootings, giving them the growth they demand.

But mass shootings also increase demand for gun control, so the gun lobby spends millions of dollars openly bribing Republicans, millions more in courts fighting progressives, and undisclosed amounts astro-turfing and seeding talking points online.

The spreadsheets say that's the path to maximum profits, so that's the path they take. They simply don't care about these 22 people or the 220 before that or the 2,200 before that. It will never be their kids expensive school.

Guns are for killing people and semi-automatic guns are for killing lots of people.

They really don't...95% of all gun homicide are done with handguns.

Good suggestion! We should ban all semi-automatic guns, long and short.

No one bats an eye at those because 85% of them are done in drug or gang violence

You forgot "domestic abuse", but I guess that was a bit too white sounding for your list.

Also, you're going to link us to the source of these figures right?

only time anyone starts talking gun control is when something like this happens.

So every couple of months then. What an odd coincidence that it lines up with the pro-guns concern about mental healthcare?

I guess this wasn't one of the 3% of shootings they intervene in, just another of the 99% they enthusiastically enable.

Sure they will. The millions of children who went to school each day knowing they were the target of domestic terrorists and were not just sold out by Republicans and the gun lobby but spat on by the pro-gun crowd.

They'll abolish the second amendment, condemning it to the history books with all the other shitty things America did like the genocide of the native population and the enslavement of black people.

Tell me again how gun control laws would have stopped this?

How about I detail all the ways he could have gotten a gun under your laws that you enable that are in effect right now?

• He bought the guns before he had mental health issues and red flag laws weren't used because police are far-right and pro-gun and put cultish, bullshit ideology before people's lives.
• He just lied or had someone else lie and the gun laws you're rushing to the defense of completely failed to catch it because they're hopelessly inadequate and designed to put lobby profits before people's lives.

At this point, we've covered 80% of mass shooters so we're looking good statistically.

• He took the legally purchased, poorly secured firearm of a "responsible gun owner" of a family member or friend because the pro-gun community staunchly insists that the "responsible" part of "responsible gun owner" is 100% optional and punishable only by the tutting of strangers on the internet.

Now we've covered over 90% of mass shooters, but most of these ones are children.

• He bought the gun in a private sale that didn't require a background check because for some surreal reason, the pro-gun crowd is completely okay with that and fights the closing of the loophole.
• He bought a previously legally purchased, poorly secured, promptly stolen gun from a stranger, because illegal firearms don't grow on trees, they're endlessly (and profitably!) by millions of people like yourself.

Which covers 99% of mass shooters. Of course deep down, you already knew all of that didn't you?

You're just not allowed to admit it out loud, because the moment you admit that in fact yes, gun control could have stopped many of these clearly telegraphed attacks, you'd have to also admit that you pushed for the laws that killed those people.

So how about instead of me explaining "how gun control laws would have stopped this" over and over again, you go fuck yourself?

You've overthrown zero tyrants. You've done nothing to lower the crime rate. You've let "suicide with dad's protect-my-family gun" become the number one cause of death for teenagers. You've insisted for 25 years that you have the answers and you've failed every single time.

When I searched to see if Maine had red flag laws, all the top results were people opposed to them.

There's a good chance the shooter was one of them, since it looks like he is a "responsible gun owner" that's even more "responsible" than most.

Of course, the pro-gun crowd will seethe if you call him that, but the reality is that he had their full support when he bought a semi-automatic weapon. He still had it when he started hearing voices. He still had it when he started prowling the streets in open carry. Fuck, they probably would have given him the benefit of the doubt when he raised it to fire on an innocent person, as long as he was staunch Republican.

But the moment he pulled the trigger, it becomes "Oh that guy? Yeah he was never one of us. Doesn't count".

Then they'll claim its a mental health problem because he had mental health issues and the gun he used to maximise the number of people he killed and wounded had nothing to do with it.

Then they'll insist that they'll totally entertain the idea of gun control after a mental healthcare system is built that can cure every single man, woman and child in America of serious mental health problems, even the ones that don't want care, so completely they can be trusted with guns for the rest of their lives because they'll never falter and also fuck you we're not paying for it.

He had mental healthcare.

He also had a legally purchased AR-15.