LucidNightmare @ LucidNightmare @lemm.ee

Posts

8

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551

Joined

2 yr. ago

I was not saying intuitive to mean windows like. I was using it as measurement of how easy it feels to learn on windows where most things are in just about plain English without as much of the technobabble.

Now that I’m more comfortable with Linux, the technobabble is at least understandable to the point that I can be a little more confident in how I navigate the computer and what not to do.

And you are right, of course. I am more comfortable with Windows, but that also gives me a little more insight into how Linux could be the absolute best of all worlds with a little conversation about the pain points and how they could be improved quite significantly.

It seems way too many people are the exact rude people I was talking about in the original comment. It’s a meme community. Your life is not on the line for Linux. I love it too.

I’m sorry that I have upset you with my comments. Nowhere did I say that Windows is great, or better than Linux.

This is a meme about Linux. I’m talking about and taking the piss out of Linux.

Windows has its issues, macOS has its issues, and so does Linux.

The best part about Linux, though, is that we can actively make it better thanks to constructive criticism and thorough feedback. You can’t really do that on the other two, so, let me voice my gripes about it in a Linux meme community perhaps?

Somehow this conversation with the rest of the users here in this thread have turned into some weird fanboy argument, so I want to go ahead and apologize for upsetting you with my comments.

Nowhere did I say Windows was better than Linux. I’ve actually stated many times that I love Linux. This is a meme for Linux, therefore I’m talking and taking the piss out of Linux.

These are real world issues that I’ve encountered myself, and seen others encounter. Just because it works for you, does not mean Linux is infallible. Windows isn’t. macOS isn’t.

I use KDE!

I’ve looked into this before , so in all seriousness, what options would I choose to make it auto mount without asking for a password?

I see the box for no automatic mount, but I don’t see one that is for auto mounting? I’m assuming the don’t prevent boot… option is pretty self explanatory.

Yeah, I understand. I’ve gotten way more comfortable with it as I’ve gotten older to where I prefer it now.

I just wish there was more understanding for those that aren’t as inquisitive as the average Linux user.

I stated about rude people online in the original comment, and sure enough, here they are in this thread, so, I appreciate your more level headed approach. Thank you. :)

I’m sorry I upset you, but the issues I’ve stated are true whether they happen to you or not.

Either way, I appreciate your input, so there’s no need for the rudeness. :)

Not on all distros, which again, makes the point of how confusing Linux can be to average users.. lol

No automount check box on openSUSE, my Linux OS.

Also, we're talking average users here, not some techy people who at least understand the differences between the OS and the file manager they use.

We were talking about average users. It's most definitely not an imaginary issue, unfortunately. I have seen it with my own eyes. It's how they have always brought their stuff into the browser, therefore, it is what they've always done. Yes, there is a browse option, but that isn't always going to be the most intuitive way.

That's great! I'm glad that it works so well for her!

That doesn't mean the issues aren't present though.

Honestly, I don't know what the difference is other than maybe Samba is easier to work with Windows than NFS? I have never had to use NFS, so there is that.

Yeah, I try to avoid talking about terminal commands, because we are trying to view it from the perspective of an average user. I brought those commands up just to show awareness of similar-esque methods you brought up. Even winget is not resistant to chicanery of some bad actor/s.

As for Windows 11, I've been on it since late 2022. It hasn't caused me any distress, but that's truly only because of the extra precautions I took when installing it. The workaround you mentioned, alongside of using ChrisTitusTech's Winutil setup to stop as much bullshit as possible. Again though, an average user wouldn't even know what's wrong with Windows to begin with.

Right, but we are talking about the average user. One who only needs a browser. They wouldn't even think about flatpak/snap/appimage, and would probably look at you like you are insane if you said those in the same sentence as "Your browser is a flatpak/snap/appimage, so it doesn't have the permissions it needs to allow drag and drop".

A lot of "beginner friendly" distros are Ubuntu based though, so while not strictly requiring you to use snaps, it might install Firefox as a flatpak though, which doesn't have the privileges to do drag and drop when I last used a flatpak based browser.

You can correct me if I am wrong of course, as I truly don't know if it is still a thing or if I just installed the flatpak. I didn't understand the limitations back then.

Because that's how I want it to behave.

My network share is for file backups, and storage. I don't want to enter my 10-15 long password to mount my NAS AND my 4 dedicated HDDs that reside in my desktop machine at every boot. That's just ridiculous in my use case.

It's this type of mindset why I feel the need to bring these issues up, because while you think that's a great idea, I find that inconvenient. Vice versa for how you feel. Options are never a bad thing to have.

For example, if I have a program that is backing up files to a cloud, files that are being held on the NAS, I would have to remember to mount the NAS before that program can do it's thing. So, every boot, you expect me to go into Dolphin and manually mount each and every drive that I may need? That does not make sense at all to me, personally. I'm glad it works that way for you though!

Very good point!

Example 2:

I need to drag this file into my browser to upload it to the website I'm visiting for whatever reason. I'm an average user that has only ever really needed a browser. My OS came with Firefox, but when I try to drag the file onto my browser window like I've always done, nothing happens. Is my computer broken?

No, it's installed as a snap/flatpak that doesn't have the "privileges" to do that, and I will never know that since I'm an average user who only needs a browser.

Installing programs through Windows is now (thankfully) more align with Linux.

winget install firefox > see two different forms, one from Windows Store (ew) and the one provided and hosted by Mozilla > winget install mozilla.firefox > program installs

When updating: winget upgrade shows available updates > winget upgrade --all updates all the listed programs

Not as good as Linux of course, but much better than the old method you stated. That point I will give to you, as it is still not simple for the average user. "Terminal? WTF is that?"

I generally don't have any annoyances with Windows because it does the things I need it to. I don't find a UAC popups as annoying, because it is supposed to help prevent people from messing their computer up. The same could be said for the average person on Linux running random commands they found online because the thing they were expecting their computer to do isn't doing the thing.

Windows has never broken on me, so I do not have a good rebuttal for that. I can at least say that when Linux has been borked before on my own hardware, I essentially had to put the ISO back on the single USB I owned at the time just to reinstall the entire OS again, because again, I didn't know anything about Linux at this time. While in Windows, if the computer doesn't boot properly 3 times, it brings up the Windows Recovery menu that has in plain English what available options you have to get your install back in at least some working manner. Again, you must keep the average person in mind. You and I are not what I would consider average in this context.

Again, point to you for the changes to UI that Micro$oft introduce. Very, very, very stupid UI/UX redesign choices, and without an alternate avenue at that! (there are a few programs that try to replace some of the Windows UI to get it back to how it should be, but of course that can introduce entirely new issues...)

I've been knuckle dragging my way into Linux more and more for 15 years. That's why I have such a strong opinion on what they could do better for the average people. UI/GUI is a must have to get people to even consider ditching Windows. That's without even taking into consideration that most of the programs I run personally do not even have a Linux alternative, and Wine/Bottles/Lutris/Heroic can not remedy without loads of understanding what you're supposed to change here and there for that specific program. That is a real nightmare in my view.

You are mostly correct that I am very much more used to the "plug and play and it just works" of Windows, but having to go and edit some config file somewhere on my computer, instead of it just being an option in the settings or in the file manager itself, is just insane to a person who just wants to set it and forget it, like I can do with Windows.

Obviously, my time with Windows is not the average either, so I can see your points. I love Linux, what it stands for, and how it is community driven. I want it to be better so I can finally delete Windows forever.

I think the main difference is that I never see Windows users say that "Windows is just SO great, you have GOT to install it right nooooooowwww!" nor Mac users. But Linux users will gladly rant and rave about their distro to normal people who are just now hearing about Linux for the first time, then get upset when that person doesn't even know how to use a terminal command.

But then again, I only have myself in my life that has any sort of interest in tech, so maybe there are and I just have never experienced it.

If the average person can not use your OS, it is not ready. Period.

For example:

Windows - Open File Explorer > Add Network Drive > Find/plug it in > Enter creds > Bam. Ready to go and will automatically log you in at boot. Very nice, very intuitive UI.

Linux - Open Dolphin (or whatever) > Network > Add Network Folder/Find it > Enter creds > Does not automatically mount the drive when booting the computer back up > Must go into fstab to get it to automount > Stop, because that is ridiculous

In my own experience, I was able to get the hang of Windows with no one showing me how a computer ever worked, at the age of 10! Intuitive enough a child can do it.

On Linux, you have to read manuals/documentation, ask random (mostly rude) people on the internet, or give up because why the fuck would I want to go and enter 5 commands just to have something as simple as auto mount a network share? Not intuitive, therefore not easy to learn as you go.

I get it, Linux people like knowing how their computers operate, they like ensuring everything is working the way THEY want to, and that's awesome! What's not awesome is recommending Linux to the general populace and then getting upset at them for asking why they can't do something or why don't they just do these steps to do whatever it is they are having issues with. Then, you have a person who doesn't even know what a terminal is confused as hell because they were told Linux is so much better than Windows.

Until we get a more intuitive (GUI focused) way of doing what I would consider normal computer tasks, it will not ever be ready. That's just the way I see it.

This is unfortunately very common when interacting with Linux users. I've had general issues on Linux that never happened on Windows, and you mostly just get replies saying it works for them and everything is dandy. That's great! It's not how I use MY computer though, so...

Not the original commenter, but we need more level-headed Linux users like you that can explain to us noobies/dabblers of Linux things we don't understand. For that, I want to say that I appreciate you!