DarthBueller @ DarthBueller @lemmy.world

Posts

4

Comments

588

Joined

2 yr. ago

I wouldn't call it a "real" history, just a richer history that leads to a more nuanced understanding of the situation, starting with the Ottoman Empire's tax reform efforts prior to WWI leading to the fellahin legally conveying their land to town leaders to avoid taxation, the descendants of said leaders considering themselves as landed gentry and who had little connection to the land, in fact most of them were living the high life in Beirut and who were more than happy to sell land to Jews. Or the state of Arab intellectual thought as it transitioned from pan-arabism to regional nationalism. Or the role the Arab League played in manipulating many Palestinians to act against their interests in the leadup to and during the 1948-1949 war (Arabs that ignored the Arab League are now, by and large, Israeli citizens, though they have legit gripes and deserve a fair constitutional government that protects them from the vageries of the volatile Israeli political process). Or how Arab nations allowed/encouraged pogroms to occur against their Jewish residents both before and after the creation of the State of Israel, persecution that (surprise surprise) led Arabic-speaking Jews to flee to the mandate/Israel. I'm NOT saying that Israel did no wrong. I'm just irritated as fuck by Israeli AND Palestinian apologists that ignore the role their side played in making the situation what it is today.

Thanks, I'll take a bridge.

I'm glad you know that Israel was formed in 1948 but your grasp on the rest of the history is poor.

You think that's going to make a difference? People don't even take a moment to parse that fully 20% of Israeli citizens are Arab, that those Arabs didn't have their land stolen, and that the reason they are in Israel is because they didn't listen to the propaganda of the Arab League that they needed to flee because Israel was going to kill them all/make it more convenient for the Arab League to kill all the Jews. No one gives a fuck about actual rich history, the role Arabs played in fucking over their own ethnic group time and again, or that the vast majority of Arab Israelis want fuck-all to do with Palestine except occasionally visit extended family members and then GTFO of the corrupt hellhole that is Gaza (while having legit gripes with how the Israeli state operates).

A substantial portion of the 20% of Israel's population that are Arab Israeli citizens would beg to differ. They have legit gripes with how the State operates, but they want jack shit to do with Palestine.

Yes, the current government tacitly tolerates illegal settlements. It's terrible. Prior governments saw them for what they were, an obstacle to peace, and understood they had to be stopped. There's a difference between Likud and the far-right batshits that have been able to barely cling to power, and the entire country of Israel.

One non-solution would be totalitarian secular governments like Egypt in both Palestine and Israel, and to immediately jail jihaadists and ultra-orthodox who make the slightest suggestion of violence. But instead there's a flawed democracy in Israel where Likud relies on the violence against Israel to gain support and a jihaadist totalitarian government in Gaza.

It's funny how everyone forgets that 20% of Israel's population is Arab, the vast majority of which are Israeli citizens, and did not have their land stolen. Most of those that fled were listening to the propaganda of the Arab states that the Jews would commit genocide and were hopeful that the forces of Lebanon, Syria, Iraq and Egypt would commit massive genocide against the Jews, some were fleeing from retribution of their own violent pogroms. Does Israel have shitty politics? Yes. Does Israel need a constitution? Yes. Is it revealing that folks don't know a damn thing about the actual history of the place when they say Israel is an apartheid state, as Palestinian leadership has, time and again, ruined hope for lasting peace. Fuck Israelis setting up illegal settlements. The fact that Netanyahu actively ignores this/encourages it is atrocious. But to pretend there is anything approaching political unity in Israel is a lie and a farce.

It's amazing, it actually led to a dramatic decrease in suicide bombings and other forms of terrorism (until it didn't). I was against the wall because it led to less opportunities for interaction, but after seeing the precipitous drop in terrorism, I can understand why even progressive Israelis were not shedding too many tears when the walls started being built en masse.

If Palestinians stopped fighting, there would still be illegal settlements encroaching on their already-compromised territory. Palestinians missed real opportunities for peace MANY MANY times. Only one real peace effort was ruined by Israel (the ultra orthodox murdering Yitzhak Rabin).

And those few make enough loud booms that create red mist carnage to ruin it for the rest of the people. Israel's response to terrorism is understandable. The problem is that modern-day zealots do shit like create illegal settlements. Israel tried preventing illegal settlements to be repaid with more bombs. Now they know they're going to get attacked either way. This will not end well, especially with Israel's current government.

If I lived in Gaza I would be royally pissed at Hamas but wouldn't say a thing because I enjoy being alive. If I lived in Gaza I would understand that the leadership was corrupt and pocketed millions of dollars of Israeli and international aid intended to allow Gaza to have its own power and water plants. If I lived in Gaza I would do my best not to live in Gaza, but would be not allowed to leave because no Arab country wants any more Palestinians then they already have.

Palestine brings violence against itself via violence against Israelis. Blowing up public busses, nightclubs, open air markets, in a way specifically designed to cause mass casualty, does wonders to make the average Israeli not give a fuck about the Palestinian cause or the righteousness or lack thereof of the Israeli government. Showing me lopsided casualty reports does not change this reality.

Not the commenter but the answer is easy - right now, it's not costing me anything to run Windows on my PC, and installing Linux takes research, time, and attention that I don't feel like investing in my home PC at the moment. Probably the next PC I build (whenever my 10 year old Dell i7 is too damn slow, only now starting to get laggy) will run Linux. Previously I only installed linux on laptops I retired from active use, just for shits and giggles. Never once had a linux powerhouse, but now that linux gaming is a reality, I'm very interested in getting away from the advertising platform that Windows has become.

The Muskovite purchasing Xitter ("X" being "sh" like in Chinese "xiao") took Xitter private. It's not "the market," it's "a handful of private investors." Not trying to play semantic games but Xitter's investors are not representative of an open market.

I hear we're likely to get Jim Jordan. UGH.

Ah, yes, the "burn it all down" contingent that DGAF about foreseeable consequences to the degree that they should be excluded from jury duty for lacking the ability to be representative of a "reasonable person," i.e., being unable to determine what a normal person would do under the same set of circumstances.