It is now illegal to use the Nazi salute in Victoria and police are warning they will take action if they see it
It is now illegal to use the Nazi salute in Victoria and police are warning they will take action if they see it
All I really have to say about this is fucking good
Edit: typo
Swede here, I completely agree!
Let's just hope the nazis never learn about the Olympic salute...
Nazism should be illegal not just the salute.
Good. Fuck the Nazis
I hate those guys !
As German, I approve of this 👍
As a person, this is agreeable.
Wrong emoji, as a German you should use this one: ✋
As a Vulcan, I do not believe your message was logical 🖖
Good. There should be no room for hate, let Nazis rot in the bins of history where they belong.
Hmmm. Between 1am and 9am on a fuckin' sunday this somehow gains an extra 39 comments
That's not suspicious at all.
This is the way.
Also a quick reminder that swastikas drawn in permanent marker can be wiped off some surfaces with a solvent, such as by using alcohol based hand sanitizer on a tissue. Both come in travel sizes.
As for ones that cannot be cleaned off, well there’s absolutely nothing you can do about that. It cannot be helped. You wouldn’t want to get caught undoing a hate symbol by drawing over it in a hilarious but completely illegal way.
Such vandalism is reserved for your own belongings because graffiti of public property is a crime. ☝️
Report it in the Snap send solve app. It will alert the council and they'll remove it within a day usually.
I forgot the /s tag
But yeah that also works
I feel like this is a pointless and totally useless crime for anyone to tackle. Like if someone drew a dick on my face with permanent marker, or spraypainted my house, I would be more concerned about why they didn't have a job rather than the actual act of spray painting to begin with. My personal take at least is that there's worse crimes out there
Except when it's other cops.
Well, at least they will easily recognize it.
Gonna make police federation meetings awkward.
Don't think I've ever seen someone go bald from the side before
Excellent law. This should be adopted worldwide.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Deputy Commissioner Neil Paterson said the update to the Summary Offences Act received royal assent on Friday, meaning that as of Saturday, it had come into effect.
A small group of about 25 members of the National Socialist Network performed Nazi salutes and displayed an anti-Semitic sign.
"If any member of public, including the National Socialist Network attend any of those rallies and undertake a Nazi salute then police will be pursuing those individuals to ensure that we enforce the new law … hold them to account, charge them and bring them before a court of law," Deputy Commissioner Paterson said.
There have been other instances of neo-Nazis demonstrating in the centre of Melbourne this year, which prompted the Victorian government to move towards outlawing the display of hate symbols.
"In terms of our Jewish community here in Victoria, we know that they have concerns at the present time due to the conflict in the Middle East," Deputy Commissioner Paterson said.
"I've personally met with a number of senior Jewish community members to give them assurance about the police activities in the state of Victoria."
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Liberal fascists: "Let me tell you why this is scary"
I'm assuming your down votes are coming from people who don't realise that the "Liberals" are Australia's more conservative party.
Yeah pretty much. It's like that where I live too. It's just Americans have a choice between the fascist liberal party and the pedo neo-nazi party so they think liberalism is a progressive camp when it's anything but.
Soon: "Victoria police completely imprisons itself"
I'm going to enjoy the tears of the masses.
The Nazis are not the masses and shouldn't be conflate with them. The libs crying over "free speech" for Nazis are also a minority.
Why would anyone (except nazis) weep about this ?
Funny how hexbear is against Nazis, except if it is russian or chinese Nazis
God dam, there's a lot of comments in there for a midnight posting. sus imo.
fair. I don't quite get how lemmy integrates. I suppose lemmy being new and a large chunk of team melbourne coming over will skew things a little.
Australia casually imports right extremist scum from other countries for decades. Also Australia ^^^
So hailing a tram will now be an open hand wave?
Happy that Naziism is becoming illegal, not so happy its the cops making the call
So fucking sick of this 'what if you this" "but whatif you that" 'won't someone pleeeeaaase think of the innocents!!' like a nazi salute is easily mistaken for something else.
It fucking isn't.
You mistake is assuming the law is being applied in good faith.
Of course hailing a tram is obviously different than a Nazi salute to anyone.
But the objective is not to detect Nazis , it's to find an excuse to harass and intimidate people.
This is just another tool in their belt.
With a new law, you should always think of how it's going to be like if applied by the most bigoted racist police officer in existence. And what mechanisms you have in place to stop that officer.
That is kind of my concern as well, it’s a pretty decent defense if caught.
Additionally, while I think nazis are the literal worst, I don’t think anyone’s right to communicate should be impeded.
Look up the paradox of intolerance.
I also agree that society should tolerate freedom of speech. But when that freedom of speech is being used to weaponize and remove others’ freedom of speech, we should not tolerate that.
Then don't hail a tram while wearing a fucking Nazi uniform and shouting Nazi slogans while demonstrating with a bunch of fucking Nazis.
"TRAM HEIL! TRAM HEIL! TRAM HEIL!"
If you're using the Nazi salute to hail a tram, you're definitely doing it wrong.
First of all, the tram will stop if you're just standing at a stop, so it's unnecessary, and if you insist on hailing, you could do it without stretching your arm all the way.
"Fine, that explains the hand gesture, but how do you explain the WWII Wehrmacht uniform?"
I'm conflicted on this. On one hand Nazis were fucking shitty people, and Neo-Nazis are shitheads too. On the other hand, freedom of speech/expression is super important. Even for these shitbirds.
Like, I don't know for sure, doesn't Australia have freedom of speech and stuff? If the people (even non-Nazis) don't say anything about this, then is it possible the government will start banning other shit? Like flipping the bird.
But also, yeah, fuck those guys.
We don't have a properly defined freedom of speech right, although our high court has ruled that we have an implied freedom of "political communication"
https://humanrights.gov.au/our-work/rights-and-freedoms/freedom-information-opinion-and-expression
Which truly doesn't matter as we are a part of the various treaties and international frameworks mentioned on that site. Treaty law is just as valid as domestic law and as long as that is held we have a right to freedom of speech with the minor caveats of not allowing racist scum to speak freely.
Yeah sure. Find something you can convince everyone is evil enough to justify your exerting control over communications. Next will be travel and business restrictions. Who's the fuckin Nazi now?
That's the thing with slippery slopes - when to stop.
...except there's a simple answer - when it gets bad.
Personally, I think fucking with Nazis is a good thing, and I'd need you to explain how banning the Nazi salute will necessarily lead to travel and business restrictions, you conspiracist crank.
You worried that Nazis doing their little taboo gang signs are gonna account to some kind of real problem? Is there any problem they could conceivably cause that's worse than a government authorizing force in response to a communication? Y'all got too much bloodthirst for building a society that doesn't devolve into fascism.
Who’s the fuckin Nazi now?
....It's still the neo nazis
As much as I hate what the Nazis did, and this resurgence of neo Nazism, I worry that raising one's hand for any purpose could be mistaken for a salute.
I hate this law. Not because I think people should be saluting like Nazis, but because it was actually needed. We should be better than that. Have we learned nothing from 80-90 years ago?
My theory: there is basically no-one left who remembers WW2 first-hand, and a lot of people only know that the atrocities were commited by "evil monsters". And we're not evil monsters, right? We're sophisticated modern humans, not evil monsters, right? We are, therefore, incapable of atrocity or even mistake and it cannot happen here, right?
It’s super frustrating for people like me who are nerds for history and are extremely aware of exactly how fascism progressed last time it got popular.
The systematic dismantling of humanities education hasn't helped this either. That's why we needs arts / humanities just as much as science. The nazis had science but they didn't have any humanity.
Not that I support their ideology at all, but the Nazis gave the world some really cool shit. Jets, rockets and the ballistic missile, the modern highway system/overpasses, and advancement in nuclear fission. Just goes to show how much war seems to advance our technology tree.
Also..Fuck Nazis
Their science was in many respects also questionable. Sure, they engineered alright but they also based sweeping policy on ridiculous race science and their astrophysics never would have panned out with their rejection of Relativity as "Jewish Physics"
Australia did at one point but then the US did a coup.
Australia is a settler colonial project built on the genocide of indigenous populations, its in the bones of your country like it is in the US, and like we inspired Nazi Germany to be
In the best of cases overcoming this history would be difficult, but we live in a world where this is not the best of cases, and where for most of history the ruling class has gone the other direction and misinformation and lies are more common than learning real history
No it does not work like that. People have to be constantly reminded about stuff like this, only then can you even have the slighest hope that it won't happen again.
It's also dumb because it can easily be abused by the police. They could easily say you were doing it when hailing a cab or waving to your friend. There is a very fine line between Heil Hitler and Hail Cab, about 45° to be exact.
Do you actually think this is likely to be a problem?
Hell, if you're actually hailing a cab, they'd likely need to chase down that cab by the time they got to you.
As stupid as it sounds, I can only imagine some poor guy with swastika tattoos trying to explain how he was only waiving a cab driver down when he gets spear tackled by some crazy Islamic state supporter
How do you think this goes in court. If this is abused it means free millions from the state for your rights being trampled on.
Nazis literally came back solely for, as the kids say, "having rizz".
Normies just suck.
Why be like this? No, it wasn't the fucking uniforms, it was the assemblage of white supremacist states that recruited Nazis and promoted aspects of their ideology all over the anglosphere.
This was rumoured to have come about because everyone was saying Dictator Dan, and throwing nazi salutes at him, though, right?
This was more about Dan not being upset, and being able to have protesters arrested if he got upset. This has been years in the making.
And now he's resigned.
That's how I understood it when it was first announced back in the day anyway.
I'd say it's got more to do with Tom Sewell and his merry band of genetic backwaters, but that'd make sense, and I don't read the Murdoch trash.
Fitting name.
We're still blaming Dan for everything?
I don't think it had anything to do with that. During lockdown people were drawing swastikas and such in my area, and for the past few years, there have been Nazis stickers going up (even before covid).
It has been increasingly escalating to worse nazi nonsense
No.
This happened after a bunch of nazis inserting themselves into everything imaginable (and yes, they did co-opt a lot of the dissatisfaction over lockdowns) pissing more and more people off until we literally ended with a situation where they got a protective cop ring around them and started flinging seig heils and there was no legal way to get them on the harm they were doing.
Fuck that noise.
Also fuckin' dan couldn't give a shit what nutballs chant in the street when the voters kept putting him back in the seat. Don't be such a five year old
I heard it was because everyone was throwing Nazi salutes in public spaces in support of the current liberal candidate but maybe whoever said that was making it the fuck up
edit for raptor squad this is entirely sarcastic but Christ you're dense mate