Skip Navigation
19 comments

  • There is a post-credits scene. (Just one, after the pretty credits.)

  • The ending of this is bad. I don't know why they did that. I really want to see Ironheart eventually become an actual superhero, but I don't know what is going to happen to her now.

    She never actually became a superhero. She never actually developed a sense of justice or a desire to do good. She never actually took to helping anyone besides her self. And then at the end, she just makes a deal with a demon to resurrect her best friend? For an origin story, this felt more like a retirement. She has no public persona or identity or motivating purpose or network. At least Kate Bishop met an Avenger and declared an intent to fight crime. But what kind of future adventures are we expecting to get with Ironheart, either solo or in an ensemble? It was a superhero origin story where no superhero originated. And it's made worse by my concerns that we'll even see this character in another show or movie. Is this just her whole arc? Is Ironheart in the MCU done now?

    What a bummer. I really hope they correct course. Make this a dream or something. I want real Ironheart.

  • That was excellent. Also...

    Mephisto

    Wanda didn't meet him, but Riri did.

    If the Marvel films aren't going to reference the TV shows (much) then Mephisto and magic can be our TV villain, our TV BBEG.

    Also I'm so glad The Hood (or I guess just Parker) gets to stick around. I'm always bummed when a villain is one and done. I get it practically speaking, but a few should survive and I think he'll be a fun choice.

  • I was thinking like “damn Riri really lost 4 suits in these 6 episode and a movie? That must be a record”. That twist at the end was great.

    • Lost 4 or had 4 total?

      1. Wakanda Forever MIT Suit (Built before the film)
      2. Wakanda Forever Wakanda Suit (Built with Shuri)
      3. Ironheart MIT Suit (Student ID required)
      4. Ironheart Car Suit (Family)

      Also Tony did way better/worse in Iron Man 3 when he had them all self destruct at the end.

  • Assorted musings:

    1. Did anybody else think that before you could see his face, Mephisto initially sounded like Benedict Cumberbatch? For a second I genuinely thought it really was gonna be Dormammu and not Mephisto. And given that in the next scene he appeared in and thereafter, he ditched the American accent, I'm pretty sure the fake-out was intentional.
    2. Speaking of Dormammu: by summoning Dormammu's power to Earth, Zelma totally just nulled and voided Dr Strange's bargain with Dormammu, didn't she? Dormammu can now argue that he was not the one who first violated the terms of the agreement; that it was an Earthling. I wonder if that'll end up being the reason Clea has to come looking for Strange's help in MoM's post-credits scene... after all, we have no specific timeframe for that scene.
    3. It seems to me that Riri basically just cribbed (and improved) BARF. Brain-scanning tech that creates a virtual reproduction of dead loved ones for a little cough therapy session? That's literally what Tony demoed when unveiling the September Grant for MIT students. Riri improved on it because now the virtual loved one can think autonomously, and the simulation only needs a single projector built into the armor rather than multiple projectors from a swarm of drones. Riri really went all-in on the whole "if I take something Iron Man did and do it better, people will take me seriously" thing.
    4. I'm glad they had Riri actually take the deal with Mephisto, as she's far more interesting as a morally compromised antihero, as the show's been portraying her all along. She has that in common with Strange, I guess! Magic really does seem to corrupt or harm almost everyone who's used it so far: Agatha, Wanda, Billy, Strange, Mordo, Riri, Parker, even the Ancient One a little... even most of Agatha's coven got sacrificed. Donnie Blaise opened a portal to a hell dimension! And Zelma seems likely to be helping Parker soon. So far, only Wong, Jennifer Kale and Ned Leeds have really escaped any noticeable consequences, and if the comics are anything to go by, then being a magic user bodes ill for Ned... satanic panic is real, kids! Magic: not even once!
    5. I wonder if Mephisto had anything to do with the generational curse placed on Alice's family.
    6. This is really just more of the "Ironheart cribs a lot from BARF" point, but "planned contingency protocol to fake a defeat so you can sneak up on your opponent" is straight from the Mysterio playbook.
    7. Why are they talking about Riri being a once-in-a-generation genius when Riri knows full well what Shuri's capable of?
    8. Do we think Riri ACTUALLY brought Natalie back from the dead, or is this more like a Scarlet Witch dealio in which she's actually just stolen a variant of Natalie from another timeline?
    9. Why on earth did Zeke go back to his house almost immediately after a prison break? Is he stupid? I mean I know he had his bionics and probably felt untouchable, but even still.
    10. So after people were complaining that the Multiverse Saga hasn't done enough to make everything feel connected, this show is continuing story threads from:
      • Iron Man (Stane family legacy)
      • Civil War (BARF, MIT, the September Grant and the Stark Legacy)
      • Doctor Strange (Dormammu)
      • Wakanda Forever (obviously)
      • Agatha All Along (Mephisto)

    • Re Benedict Mephistobatch, it definitely didn't sound like Sacha Baron Cohen at first, but I didn't hear Benedict. I think The Hood/Parker makes a comment about his voice but I assume any voice change is just Mephisto finding which voice they find the most comfortable. When both Parker and Riri are sitting at the pizza table it's clear they aren't 100% there with the jarring camera cuts.

      Re Dormammu summoning & agreements. I think that works out and I like it. I did a little digging and due to the events of Spider-man FFH and NWH we know those take place in 2024, and Multiverse or Madness right after also in 2024. Wakanda Forever has a deleted scene that has it starting in 2024, but since it has a "one year later" scene, would put it in 2025. Then Ironheart is supposedly six months after Wakanda Forever. However Multiverse of Madness ends with Strange growing a third eye, then the mid credits has him not worried about and utilizing the third eye. So that scene could have happened anytime. (Although that scene talks about incursions, but it could still tie in).

      Re BARF I wonder if she built her own or borrowed and improved on Tony.

      Re Taking the deal. As soon as she asked the clarifying question, "And you only want me, it will only affect me?" I knew she was going to take the deal. At that point she's already accepted it in her head and was trying to talk herself out of it, but she couldn't. It was such a great scene.

      Re Generational Curse. I expect Mephisto helped Agatha obtain the Darkhold, but I think the family curse was just Agatha. Any manifestation of the curse that we saw was just Billy.

      Re Mysterio. I hope he faked his death and returns someday. He's one of my favorite villains.

      Re Once in a lifetime genius. Shuri and Wakanda don't make themselves known to the larger world. Outside of Wakanda few know who Shuri actually is and even if they do, she just has Wakanda technology, no one knows Shuri made it,

      Re Natalie. Riri fails to create a duplicate Natalie after the first one is deleted in the magic deal. Riri has no idea why it fails a second time. To me this means someone else (Mephisto) was involved the first time. Second the new Natalie isn't aware of the old Natalie or what is going on, which is to say a different Natalie, but I'm not sure Riri knows what she's brought back since she was surprised Natalie could interact with her. Since one of the themes of the show was death/acceptance, I think she brought dead Natalie back.

      Re Zeke. To destroy the flowers again. He hates flowers.

      Re Connections. Also Thor and his hammer.

    • Re 8: the thing about Wanda's boys was that she thought her ones were actually in a different universe, right? Because Billy projected his soul into the Kaplan boy, and Tommy's into who knows whom. So when Wanda would search her boys magically she couldn't find them, only the ones from a different universe.

      As opposed to Natalie, whom Mephisto could probably pluck from any dimension or plane. So I think she is the original one who was dead - although it could be interesting if Mephisto did the same thing as Wanda and stole her off a different timeline.

      Re 10: I wrote this under one of the earlier episode discussion posts already, but I love this about this show. It didnt need to introduce a lot of things itself, because it builds on so many established things. Really feels like MCU.

  • Man, Mephisto drove me crazy. I definitely knew the actor but just couldn't figure out who he was. I don't think I've ever seen Sacha Baron Cohen play a serious role before and he knocked it out of the park!

  • What are they smoking at Marvel?

    Why would you go out of your way to not have Mephisto show up in Wandavision and No Way Home, only to introduce him here? How does that make any sense?

    And no, I' not convinced by this show that Riri would actually strike a deal with him to revive Nathalie. Not after Xavier's reactions.

    • Yeah, I'm just trying to imagine the reactions. Her mom should be pissed that she revived Natalie but didn't ask for Gary too. And Xavier is gonna be all over the place. And then of course we have no idea how Natalie is going to feel about it.

      Also, how do you get a drivers license or a social security card? Do you just say, 'Well you see, I was resurected by magic. Yes, my death certificate is 100% valid. It was not a mistake. I was reconstituted from nothing by the devil in a pact made by my best friend for her soul. Yes, really. Yes, I mean this literally, not figuratively. No, no super-science or time travel. No, not THE devil, but yes and actual demon. My original body? Well that's kind of macabre. I hadn't thought about it. I think since I reappeared in a summoning circle there's about a 50-50 chance that either my corpse is still in the cemetery or an urn or that it disappeared at the same time my living body appeared. I don't know. Age? I don't know, um, it's been 5 years, so why don't you just leave my birthday unchanged. Blipped? Hmm, I don't recall. It hasn't come up so I don't really know if I was blipped or not. Lets say yes, that seems to make things easier, right? Thanks.'

      • Her mom should be pissed that she revived Natalie but didn't ask for Gary too.

        Her mom was amazed when Natalie first appeared and later on in the series asked if she could build an AI Gary too.

        Additionally Mephisto didn't revive Natalie (at the end of the series), he gave Riri the tools to revive Natalie. It is possible Riri will revive Gary next. Riri also didn't seem to fully understand what she created/revived because she didn't expect that Natalie could touch her. I expect everyone is just going to be amazed at what Riri did.

        As for paperwork, they live in a post-blip society with aliens, androids and wizards. Sure this is weird, but they'll figure it out. In fact Natalie returning might get the attention of some big names like SWORD or Doctor Strange.

  • The juxtaposition between Parker and Joe as sons of powerful rich men is interesting.

    Wtf is that ballbusting scene doing in a Disney property? That was just weird man

    Smart move by Riri to use holograms to trick Parker

    Also, I would have stopped using that elevator weeks ago! I already thought this when the entire crew left Parker last episode, I feared he might kill them all while in the elevator..

    "I made a deal with... also a Beatle – Ringo" lol Mephisto

19 comments