7mo ago

The rise of a ‘dangerous’ ideology among parents is causing havoc in custody disputes

www.theguardian.com

Self-declared sovereign citizens, who believe Australia’s laws do not apply to them, are having a serious impact on the family court, experts say

Kind of odd to me becase even if you do believe this, the judicial institutions have armed police and jails on their side and you have your thumbprint, (unkess your name is Train I guess, which was a whole other thing) seems a losing battle from the get go? Whats the upside ?

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I don't think there is necessarily an upside for the people who fall for this stuff hook, line and sinker. But there does seem to be an upside for the grifters selling all kinds of sovereign citizen passports, IDs, licences, certificates among other things online.
- The "upside" for the people who fall for it is that they feel like they discovered some big secret and that they get to feel smarter because of it. SovCit ideology is basically just magic. This odd idea that if you say the right magic words, things will always go your way.
  
  @Aradina @maniacalmanicmania
  Yup. It’s an illusion of control and safety.
  Which people like to feel very smug and superior about, while generally doing it themselves in less conspicuous ways.
  
  The puzzling thing is that after the magic words don't work the first time they don't give up on it.
  
  They want to be part of the class that the law protects but does not bind.
Tbh if you pull that sovcit bullshit in court it should count against you. The idea is to keep kids in stable homes.
- Sure but some people get passionate about their children and partners separating can be toxic. Not the time when most peoole are going to make sane choices, so i have some empathy.
  I don't have kids, had a vasectomy decades ago as the world is full but i have some empathy. Seems a weird choice to make though, as a sovcit, as there is no upside ? The police and courts have all the power and yiu can try and use them to your best advantage but saying they hold no sway over you seems bizzare.
Kind of odd to me becase even if you do believe this, the judicial institutions have armed police and jails on their side
It's a kind of magical thinking. They think they've discovered a magic loophole that means even by the institutions' own laws, they can invalidate the institutions' power.
sovcitz get one thing right: our laws are kinda meaningless and a stupid game played by the powerful.
Then they forget: Even when it's being nonsensical the state is fucking terrifying and armed men with guns will torture you until you comply.
And instead of trying to improve things they start filing paperwork they've jizzed on under a full moon while one foot is in the ocean and the other dry land like it means anything.
- sovcitz get one thing right: our laws are kinda meaningless and a stupid game played by the powerful.
  Oh, i completely agree, that's not really the point though. They have guns, jails and lots of people to taser and beat you for non compliance. Your thumbprint and belief in your convictions isn't going to cut it
  
  I obviously can't speak for all the sovcits, but I get the impression that they typically haven't seen the tough side of the system until a legal dispute like custody in a divorce, which pushes them into the movement. Some other people are well-exprienced with the contradictions between the legal system and state violence, but those sovcits are used to law being the highest power and see what they're doing as legal and therefore righteous and protected, they have faith in legal loopholes. They're not criminals! They don't get beaten and tasered and jailed! Not sure what they think of all the cops ripping down car windows in the US... clearly power prevails over ideals when you challenge the status quo.
  Compare and contrast with, say, the anarchist movement who are more than familiar with guns, jails, tasers and beatings.
'I don't believe laws apply to me.'
Cool, you lose custody. Next.
- All well and good until they start forming armed harassment groups, as at least one lot of them here has. Then you need to say more than "next".
  
  All the more reason not to entertain their bullshit.

17 comments