Windows 10 is the last version of Windows
Just a moment...
Raising this dead article as Microsoft now delivers extended support pricing details for those who choose not to migrate to the newer version of Windows. The one they were told they'd not ever have to migrate to
I'll probably get down voted to oblivion, but I remember EVERYONE had the same "I'll never move" rhetoric with Windows 7, and before that Windows XP. Ya'll eventually move.
I've moved 3 of my 6 windows boxes from 10 to 11 and it's not that much different. I just debloat the stuff I don't want and move on. Even that isn't different, ya'll remember nlite? We've been ripping crap we didn't want out of the OS for as long as I can remember.
Hell, I even remeber getting doublespace.exe off my old dos 5 disks so I could use it on my dos 6 and Windows 3.1.1 install. People who use Windows are just more used to tearing down what they don't want rather than building up what they do (*nix). Is it harder these days...marginally...is there more to remove...yup. But it's still the same crap we've always done.
The difference this time is that my computer literally can't run Win 11. I'm not throwing away a perfectly good PC just because of Win 11's hardware requirements.
Especially not for such enragingly artificial hardware requirements. Any computer able to run 64-Bit Win XP would probably run Windows 11 just fine if Microsoft hadn't decided to build instructions that only work on recent CPUs into the kernel specifically to make it not run on older hardware.
If you still need/want to run Windows 11, you can download the ISO from Microsoft, and burn it to an USB Stick using Rufus.
Rufus lets you disable all those requirements.
But I wouldn't count on it working forever. Any Update could break your OS, cause Microsoft expects you to install it on conforming hardware.
So I WAS on 11 until all of the sudden my computer refused to boot with the special hardware thing enabled. Had to downgrade to Windows 10 and the mobo manufacturer's response was 'try replacing every other part in your PC'...sorry I don't have the money to have spare parts of everything just lying around. 10 works perfectly fine, and it'll give me an excuse to upgrade my mobo in Oct 2025. :-)
Maybe to 12, a lot of people stuck with 7 until 10, because 8 sucked. A lot of people stuck with XP because Vista sucked. A lot of people are sticking with 10 because 11 sucks. In history, Microsoft has had a usable OS every other.
If 12 is shit, perhaps Linux will finally get its day.
I remember EVERYONE had the same “I’ll never move” rhetoric with Windows 7
I did eventually move... to Linux. Windows 7 was the last version of Windows I've had installed on any machine I own.
Honestly 11 was finally the push I needed to try Linux as my main driver. Gaming finally got to the point where I could switch. The only thing they made in 11 that was beat was AutoHDR. Everything else was annoyance to me.
Dude stop reminding me how old I am. I just discovered arthritis bones that my favorite grandma decided to give me this morning.
Cheers mate!
I moved away, but not to newer windows.
I completely forgot about doublespace and all the XX-DOS stuff was when I was a teen. Had fun messing around with DR-DOS and wish I would have found Linux back then.
I never upgraded from Win 7. I used in untill Steam stopped its support and now my gaming rig runs on Linux.
Well, if you're sticking with Windows, you really have no choice. The sun is rapidly setting on using Windows 7 as a "daily driver" - a lot of new software doesn't support it and the older versions that work on Windows 7 are getting less and less viable. Windows 8 is in the same boat as Windows 7. Windows 10 goes out of support next year, but you've probably got to 2028 or maybe 2029 before you really have to move.
I ended up riding Windows 7 pretty much to the bitter end. Steam dropping Windows 7 support last December was it for the last Windows box. Everything now is running Linux.
Windows 10 is the last version of Windows (that I am going to use)
I'll be the guy in this thread, I switched to mint for everything except CS2 (Wtf valve fix your native client) and will not be looking back.
I had to use windows yesterday. Public computer at a print shop.
Everything was shades of white, the scroll bar was barely visible, when I enlarged a window the ux elements scaled up, and there was already tons of dead ui space, so I assumed there weren't any more to show. Also, every program, even though they were all Microsoft, gave a different screen when I hit control p.
I couldn't figure out how to adjust paper size. Ive been using computers since 199(2/3), when I could barely talk. Ive used legacy systems older than me-for industrial shit, for novelty. I grew up mostly a MS-DOS then windows girl. I've installed arch. Ive run arch successfully as a daily driver, then moved to qubes for a few years. I have systems so hacked together, I need to lick a bit of wire I connected poorly to trigger a thing (3v, its fine) I currently have a dead bug soldered project sitting half finished next to me (the hardware is done, works, I'm just bad at code), in a room that could mostly pass for the set of a live action 'serial experiment lain' remake.
And I couldn't adjust print settings on modern windows. Because it's just that garbage. Two days ago I wasnt a fanatical Linux partisan. I think I am now.
You have to understand technology is constantly evolving, which requires upgrades to allow utilization those technologies.
So they probably needed the upgrade for a new EULA, to allow for improved shenanigans built right into Windows, that will be a huge benefit to Microsoft, and would allow closer more invasive monitoring of your system, but wouldn't be legal without the new EULA.
Very legal and very cool. 🤑
Yes but then vanguard and blackrock (they control about 15% of m$ shares) saw that their investment in AMD (again, with 15% they're the biggest institutional shareholders) and their investment in Intel (more billions in shares) needed a way to increase CPU sales, so they told Microsoft to add artificial CPU requirements in order to send to the dumpster any computer produced before 2018
send to the dumpster any computer produced before 2018
You mean send into the arms of a frugal Linux enthusiast ;)
Everyone that was paying attention to the Microsoft Windows support lifecycle web page back then knew that statement was horse shit.
Well, on one hand you had one line in a table in a formal web page.
On the other, you had that very awkward phrasing (if he merely meant 'latest'):
because Windows 10 is the last version of Windows, we’re all still working on Windows 10,
But maybe that was a misunderstanding and he did mean 'latest', but in the flurry of internet coverage, Microsoft never issued a statement highlighting the misunderstanding. Instead they let that run rampant.
In fact, it was very consistent with a lot that happened with Windows 10:
So while certainly that one lifecycle page did have it stated, I have to wonder why Microsoft was mum on the subject even as their community was 'getting it wrong'. I wouldn't be surprised if the reality is that they were seriously considering it. That guy might have even meant 'last' because he thought the 'eternal update' camp were going to win out.
And the thing of it is, millions of non-tech savvy people would not mind about having to move to Windows 11 and would do so in due course if Microsoft didn't deliberately cripple it so it won't run on a wide swath of not-too-old hardware.
It's funny how media widely misreported this, but what's not funny is that people believe that to this day. Even in this thread people think Microsoft said that.
The quote is in the article:
Right now we're releasing Windows 10, and because Windows 10 is the last version of Windows, we're all still working on Windows 10,
They obviously meant Windows 10 is the latest version of Windows, but I guess misconstruing the quote got the clicks and then everyone went along. There was never any announcement from Microsoft, all of the "Windows 10 is the final version of Windows" thing is based on misconstruing the quote. If a reporter really believed this interpretation to be the case, it would be easy to just ask Microsoft, but they didn't. Or did, got the "lol no of course it's not last" answer and ignored it because that would make their clickbait article go away.
I don’t think that’s a fair interpretation, I think Microsoft absolutely intended what they said here, that Windows 10 was the last version of Windows. Hence the shift in development strategy. Annual breaking updates rather than new full releases, the new month-year versioning cycle, free for anyone with a valid Windows 7, 8 or 8.1 license.
I think the goal was to eventually drop the “10” and for it to just be Windows as a service, where major versions don’t really matter and the UX slowly evolves over time rather than in one big change.
Then, something happened. Obviously this is purely speculative, but I suspect either the executive championing this strategy left, or they saw it cutting into their profits more than they anticipated, or enterprises complained about frequent breaking updates, who knows. Then Windows 11 appeared out of nowhere. The signalling from MS for enterprise was clear. Stop monolithic imaging and site-wide rollouts, instead test applications with a pilot group and then push the annual releases wide if no issues are found.
I definitely think something changed. While you’re right that this is the only quote supporting it directly, when asked in follow-ups Microsoft went out of its way to NOT deny the statement or confirm it. If the plan was the status quo, they would have just said “we have not changed our release model at this time” but they didn’t. They knew full well that based on how widely reported that quote was, people would infer that it was the strategy. If they felt so strongly that it was just a simple misspeaking, they would have said so.
Windows 11 is technically still Windows 10, if you go by the actual version reported by the systeminfo command. For example, my fully updated Windows 11 Pro VM reports itself as OS Version: 10.0.22631, so there might still be something to the idea that "Windows 10 is the last version" but the marketing and branding teams didn't stay on the same message.
Yep. The fact that Windows 11 exists ought to be a clue.
What????? When was anyone gonna SAY something?!?!?!?!
I'll be staying on 10 for as long as possible, so that by the time I have to upgrade people will have found ways to mod most of the bullshit out of the newer version.
This whole thing is rather weird. Windows 10 had a set lifetime when it was launched (see this link for details) so the developer evangelist was just plain wrong. They should've issued a correction, but this one guy at a conference and that one tweet was enough to somehow convince everyone that no more versions of Windows would come out, even though that directly conflicted with the well-documented information available online.
As for migration: over the past years, you have migrated your Windows install several times. Every major update ( "Redstone", "Creator update") has been a major Windows upgrade akin to upgrading from Vista to 7. Microsoft made the process seemless enough that you don't notice this, but you have already migrated several times (or you're running an unsupported version of Windows anyway, unless you're on some kind of weird IoT version).
Microsoft started dropping support lifecycles with Windows 11, which currently only has about one year of support left, officially. Will Windows 11 be the final version of Windows? Probably not.
which currently only has about one year of support left, officially
Well, no, "Version 23H2" only has one year of support. The 24H2 update will likely happen and likely have support until 2026. They do not list a retirement date for "Windows 11", only for the updates.
You are right that for 10, the formal documentation listed an EOL. I can also believe that the "last version" was started by a misunderstanding. However, that "Windows 10 is the last version" spread hard and Microsoft made no effort to correct that at all. If there's one thing internet sites love more than over-speculating about a potential mis-speak, it's showing their fellow internet sites to be morons by posting Microsoft statements clarifying things. So Microsoft had to have noticed and still opted not to interject. I wouldn't be surprised if there was some "we are going to make Windows 10 a rolling release" sentiment bouncing around at Microsoft. It would be consistent with how they declared that new features and deprecations would come twice a year.
The last [good] version of Windows.
That would be 7. With 10 Microsoft went heavily into the snooping business.
The telemetry of Windows 10 back in 2015 ain't got jack shit on the adware craziness they got years later
The LTSC version of Windows 10 is pretty good, relatively. No bloat or ads.
8.1 is a faster version of 7 that also has some compatibility with apps that are said to require 10. Just disable those metro things and use your favorite app for start menu.
Longhorn (pre-reset) was my last version of windows back in 2004. after that mess, i refused to ever go back.
Windows 7 was peak Windows experience IMO, and to follow it up win Windows 8...
I still remember my first windows 7 install. I remember my wallpaper. It was winter. I rocked a digital blasphemy snowman wallpaper. Shortly after, doom 3 was released. The amount of counter strike I played on there was problematic. I remember installing like a game desktop where it was an fps and I could arrange things and walk to different rooms of a house which were just folders of shortcuts and shit. Lol. It was neat for a bit.
So nostalgic now.
I consider Windows 7 the last good version, but I still consider Windows 2000 to be when Microsoft was at the top of their game.
Windows 7 is awful
The name came from the bar in Whistler, BC... might give a little more insight into the development team...
Shit TIL. I was up there a few weeks ago.
i know.
fyi, WindowsXP was codenamed "Whistler". Windows 7 was originally codenamed "Blackcomb", but that codename was later dropped. Windows Home Server 2011 was codenamed "Vail".
the MS team has a history of using ski resorts and related names as codenames for windows betas.
The only reason I still have Windows are a few games that don't work properly on Linux (via Steam Proton) yet.
I will keep Windows 10 until Steam no longer supports it or all my games run well on Linux (I check for that occasionally). IDGAF about no longer getting security updates as I have moved everything except for those few games to Linux years ago.
I multibox a certain game and that is something proton simply can't handle. It's only designed with a single game in mind so each instance runs it's own layer which quickly eats up resources that are never freed up.
if I'm ever forced to upgrade my base system I guess the first thing I'll do is try my game in a windows VM
Windows 11 for work, 10 for the games that don't work on manjaro.
And really, it would have worked. Too bad the suits and marketing got bored
Had to use win11 yesterday.
It was completely unusable fucking trash and even the ux was terrible.
If it helps, my media drives transferred straight over to Linux when I cleaned by last windows device.
It was completely unusable fucking trash and even the ux was terrible.
How do you say this with a straight face. I know, just know, you want to push Linux, it's a must here on Lemmy, but to say it's unusable trash does more to denigrate my opinion of your opinion than my opinion of the OS. It functions substantially similar to W10.
I want to truly know what you mean. What did you try to do but were 100% prohibited doing due to W11?
Should still make the switch imo lol
I must be in the minority that actually prefers 11 to 10
I honestly don't care between 11 and 10, since switching there hasn't been an impactful difference for me.
I will however revel in the memery that Microsoft has brought upon itself.
i moved pirated ltsc. my free w10 licence burned but its ok :D
I would use Linux but my graphics card only has nouveau drivers in Linux and that's a lot worse than Nvidia drivers in Windows 10. Same for some older ATI/AMD cards that still pack a punch in Windows with the official drivers but aren't supported in Linux in official drivers.
Out of curiosity, what GPU do you have that is not decently supported? Both the latest AMD and NVidia stuff is, at least for the general public stuff.
I will have a look and get back to you.
I must admit however that I have had a change of mind after my comment and that it may have been a failure on my end. I think I may have overlooked an option for at least one of my cards, and I have since also found a guide that uses a PPA in Ubuntu.
Also besides this I have some really old (pci-express) graphics cards in active use because they are better than onboard and the pc's are still fast enough. But it would be nice to get those working with official drivers (even if older) so that some simpler games like FlatOut 1 & 2 can still be played on them.
I am mostly a Linux user (surprise, Lemmy!) but recently started a new job. Given the choice of a Windows laptop vs a Macbook Pro, I took the latter, despite my long-time distaste for Apple.
I do not, even in a work setting, even want to touch Windows 11 in any recurring capacity (yes, I did try it -- at my last role).
Move over Arch, I am the rolling release right now
If you have to use windows 11, use https://github.com/rbleattler/BloatyNosy to clean it up.
Be really careful as that can open up security holes
And if you are not the most tech savvy, read through the options to make sure it is what you need removed. Removing everything might break some things, because M$.
I can safely say that removing the telemetry is absolutely essential. Remove it from Firefox, and (ew) Chrome (ew, ew) alongside Windows telemetry because fuck that shit.
Well I suppose they were right. Windows 10 was the last version of Windows for me. I'm okay with not using what little only works on windows. Unless you need something more niche/specialised, windows isn't worth the pain.
I wish I felt this way. I installed SuSE Tumbleweed a while ago, and while I overall liked it, it was so finicky. My bluetooth ceased working after updating a bunch of stuff and I never got it working again. I feel like things are very rarely plug and play with Linux, something Windows has gotten pretty good at since, well at least XP.
Back when I used Linux as my daily driver, around 2007-2011 I was okay with that. Sure I had issues every so often, but I didn't mind spending time to solve them. Nowadays when I spend 8 hours in front of the computer for work, if I want to spend more time in front of the computer it's generally because I either want to enjoy a game, or experiment with music, what have you, and having things spontaneously crap out on me would drive me nuts.
Maybe SuSE Tumbleweed wasn't the right choice. My thinking there was; a rolling distro will always be up-to-date, no more big OS upgrades ever, I'll just set things up the way I like it and that's that.
That's really the biggest problem I think Linux has, unfortunately it's also one of Linux's best features - it's not a uniform experience. Yours won't be the same as mine, etc.
Some things that should be simple aren't, and sometimes getting things going can be frustrating, and you will without question at some point have to troubleshoot and fix something.
I'm fortunate that I have a lot of background and experience in the industry, and I can understand people don't want to go to that trouble, just like people don't want to learn to cook.
Most things in Linux I find these days do plug and play to some degree, but there is absolutely missing effort and/or openness from the hardware vendors. Like not being able to configure macro keys/extra mouse buttons without a windows vm.
Having said that, I found the way windows was going, adding crap into the os that I don't want, and constantly changing where settings are etc. Changing my defaults, and so on. There's just too much I don't like about the way it's managed. Also, winsecure.
If you install Linux on any sort of proprietaryish system. Dell, HP, Lenovo, etc. You need to expect to have some issues. And it's not linux's fault.
If you want to have a smooth "just works" experience with Linux. Either buy a system made to run it. System 76, tuxedo etc. Or build it yourself if you have the know how.
You wouldn't try to install Mac OS on a non Mac and expect it to work flawlessly. We shouldn't expect that of Linux either. It often still does. But that's besides the point.
My favorite laptop to use right now A 2017 HP elitebook with an AMD chipset. The Bluetooth is indeed a bit of a problem unfortunately. But if I took the time to source a decent Intel m.2 upgrade board. It would be flawless apart from the fingerprint sensor which will never work. But again, that's not linux's fault.
Make the investment into a compatible system and you won't regret it.
Yeah, same for me. I'm using the time between now and paying for updates to do research on what distro I want to try to learn... I've used Ubuntu a long time ago, but I'm not sure that's exactly what I want.