1y ago

Oh look, cracking down on Big Tech works. Brave, Firefox, Vivaldi surge on iOS

www.theregister.com

Brave, Mozilla, Vivaldi see browser installs rise on iOS

Since Apple implemented a browser choice screen for iPhones earlier this month to comply with Europe's Digital Markets Act (DMA), Brave Software, Mozilla, and Vivaldi have seen a surge in the number of people installing their web browsers.

It's an early sign that Europe's competition rules may actually … get this … enhance competition – an outcome that skeptics deemed unlikely.

Technology @lemmy.ml

Zerush @lemmy.ml

1y ago

Brave, Mozilla, Vivaldi see browser installs rise on iOS

www.theregister.com /2024/03/14/brave_mozilla_europe_ios/

48 comments

Oh noes! Innovation is being stifled by excessive regulation!
- Ayn Rand would be so disappointed. SMH.
It's good news but the true test will be on if those users are retained. It's possible the uptick is just a case of iPhone users seeing a new screen they've never seen before and trying the browsers out of curiosity.
Which would definitely be a good thing. Anything that gets the average user to even consider the wild notion of trying something other than the default would be a monumental improvement to the entire tech market.
But I still think the actual numbers on new active users will probably not be as high. Higher, yes, but not a monumental shift. Anything is an improvement, though.
I think it's also possible this is more likely to happen in EU countries than the US. It really feels like European users are generally more willing to use alternative things.
- I bet, assuming users are never shown the browser selection screen again, they’ll only go back to Safari if there’s something they hate about their new browser.
  I hope autofill, iCloud keychain, Apple Pay, and automatic confirmation code insertion from text messages are all supported. Apple is a professional degraded experience implementer.
- On macbooks Safari is excellent for battery life. Absolutely blows every other browser out the water. If the same optimisation has been done on mobile, then people will go back for that alone. Safari has less add-ons and a less intuitive interface (if your not accustomed to Mac) but the longer battery life makes up for the inadequacy.
  
  I'd wager that the battery life comparison would be essentially negligible in day to day use.
  
  ... So in your mind people are using web browsers for hours and hours on their phones, enough to notice battery life issues? I question that. Maybe 2% of people would. But my guess is many of those would value features that Safari doesn't have. As a web developer, that browser is beyond trash. Maybe it doesn't drain batteries as quickly because it flat out doesn't support huge swathes of w3c approved features.
Explain why Chrome is the #1 free app in germany. Them people just jump to the next big bully
- Firefox is on #52, Edge #63 and brave #191
- Huh
an outcome that skeptics deemed unlikely
More like "an outcome that denialists deemed unlikely".
Skeptics actually think things through and draw conclusions about likely outcomes based on actual real reasons, hence might very well conclude a claim that something will work if all indications point towards that. It's not about refusing to believe a positive outcome, it's about checking the logic behind the argument being made, and not just for positive outcomes, also for negative ones.
Denialists simply refuse to admit something can or did happen or work as intended, no reasons necessary.
It's highly unlikely that a real skeptic will conclude that people having freedom to choose in a user friendly way when previously they had no user friendly choice at all, will not enhance competition, whilst a denialist will just claim "it won't" work with no actual logical reason backing that conclusion.
- Yeah nobody is on the other side of this issue. They literally FORCE you to choose a browser, how would that ever result in anything but a bump for alternative browsers?
  Bigger issue is, how many people just went right to Chrome? Mobile Safari and its massive chunk of e-commerce sales is about the only thing causing businesses to not just code for Chrome and call it a day. You don’t want more mobile or desktop Chrome users, period.
  
  There was no genuine competition on browsers before in iOS, now there is.
  It's quite irrelevant for the subject of competition if the reduction of the market share of the browser that had no competition due to artifical barriers (Safari) goes mostly to the browser with the most overall market share (Chrome) or not as long as it happens via competition.
  Your point only makes sense if this was about "diversity" in the browser market (in which case it's absolutely valid to think that this might very well reduce it), however competition-wise, any consumer choice always means more competition than no consumer choice.
  That said, on the competition side this does raise a question about user-friendly browser selection in Android.
Have they actually made non-Webkit versions though, or is it still just WKWebView? A part of me thinks Apple has already kind of won this. They started allowing plugins and such a while ago, and at this point it covers my needs. Safari is really well-designed for phones as well, and the times I've tried using Firefox it just feels awkward and clunky - not because of the engine, but because of the general UX.
I'm sure opinions differ, and I really do hope more people will swap over to Firefox (Brave and Vivaldi can fuck themselves), but it doesn't really feel like a big win unless you get more tangible benefits; different engines, plugin support, etc.
- I use Firefox on all my machines and I enjoy having my Sync account available everywhere. If I were to get an iPhone, I'd absolutely choose Firefox again.
  
  Yeah this is the one thing I've considered myself. I just can't get over how much better Safari's UI is on iPhones. It's a bit whatever on iPad, but on the iPhone it's just so intuitive. I think the two things I like the most are
  The bottom of the screen UI Chrome, because that just makes so much sense. Sure iOS has that accessibility feature (which I really hope Android adopts soon) where you swipe down on the bar at the bottom to bring the top of the screen down, but that's one extra gesture I have to use to access the URL bar. Other than preference there's no real reason to keep it on the top - which there's a setting for in Safari, so you could have either way.
  As I wrote this I was like "but what if there's a setting for it in Firefox as well?" and there is, so consider that point moot!
  It also lets you navigate tabs without having to open the tab switcher. Swiping left takes you to the previous tab, and right to the next, if there is no next tab it opens a new tab. It's also really snappy so it's easy to navigate between like 2-8 tabs or so.
  So as a bonus thing; I really like the transparency effect. It's super superficial, I know, but it makes the view feel bigger somehow, and it fits with the overall native UX which is something I as a developer generally consider a good thing. Though honestly it's not a dealbreaker for me.
  If the tab switching was implemented, and they swapped over to Gecko I'd probably consider switching to Firefox altogether on my mobile devices.
- Um what did Vivaldi do wrong? Is it just cause it's Chromium?
  
  Yeah, it's just because it's Chromium. I don't know anything about the company so I don't have any opinion there.
  I used to be of the opinion that it'd be nice if the web unified under one platform. Honestly, I still hold that opinion, but the caveat there would obviously be that no single company should control that platform. Google does control Chromium. All Chromium based browsers will see Manifest V3, and that's just one thing. Google can do more or less what they wish, and the rest of the web will just kind of have to take it.
  They're in a similar position that Microsoft was in back when Internet Explorer was an actually good browser, but unlike Microsoft I don't think Google will rest on their laurels. It's really worrying to me that Google essentially owns the internet.
  
  Chromium and proprietary.
- There have been rumors that Apple would open it up for iOS, but I wasn’t sure if they still require Webkit, so I looked it up.
  Apparently, in the EU, they can use their own tools as of 17.4 (which just released) but I guess US still uses WebKit.
  
  Yeah, I'm in the EU so it's been decently big news here. That said I'm having a hard time believing that they'd make separate versions of their browsers for the EU and then the rest of the world. That's a lot of work for a potentially very small market.
Advertising works, is more like it.

48 comments