Skip Navigation
homeassistant @lemmy.world
Dave @lemmy.nz

Smart button not near zigbee hub

I'd like to add a smart button to my HA setup. I don't have zigbee signal nearby, so I'm wondering what the best way to do this would be.

I'm using a Skyconnect dongle. There's wifi nearby. I want to control a smart switch nearby, which would also have zigbee but that also wouldn't reach the distance I need.

Is Matter a solution here? With a hub connected to wifi that bridges to the button?

Any suggestions on hardware?

Or any other suggestions?

28 comments

  • Can you not add a Zigbee extender?

    Edit: Or just use the bottom over WiFi?

    Edit 2: Or use this as an excuse to buy more Zigbee products to build up your mesh network until it reaches where you want to place the button

    • Are there longer range zigbee extenders? I would like to avoid having to find places for a bunch of smart plugs across the house to extend the signal.

      Wouldn't wifi battery operated buttons need batteries replaced all the time, isn't that one of the reasons for something like zigbee, the low power usage?

      • With an extender, it's essentially a second coordinator. But it's worth mentioning that a good Zigbee network is full of routing devices, so your network should be pretty far reaching anyway.

        If the button you want to set up is far away from everything else, then WiFi or Bluetooth are definitely worth considering, because it is better to change batteries more often than be forced to add a bunch of devices to get one to work.

      • You can put a coordinator in relay mode and use that, the antenna would help with the range. Get one of those outlets with USB and a right-angle cable and it'll be nice and low profile too.

  • There’s a couple of ways you can do this.

    • You can build out your Zigbee network with relays (anything mains powered usually works as a router) to reach the area.
    • If the area is too far away (say in another building), you could setup a Zigbee to MQTT router nearby and route the messages via another network back to Home Assistant.
    • or your could use WiFi devices if you have enough spare capacity on your network and are well within signal range.

    I’ve so far not had much luck with Matter, so for me, that is an unnecessary complication to avoid. Trying to get Matter working, I mean.

    In my case I would probably use either the first or second choice, depending, but your situation may be different. My WiFi already has too many devices on it.

    • If the area is too far away (say in another building), you could setup a Zigbee to MQTT router nearby and route the messages via another network back to Home Assistant.

      Can you tell me more about this? Wifi is available in the area, which seems a better option than a chain of zigbee extenders.

      Can I just get a zigbee to MQTT router and that bridges between a zigbee button and HA?

      • It sounds like you may be confusing how Zigbee works with how older WiFi works.

        In WiFi you would have a single access point with a certain range. If you want to extend that range in a particular direction you would have to add a range extender, creating a chain or rope of range extenders.

        Zigbee (and many modern WiFi APs) are more like a fishing net. The more relays you have the stronger your net is because if one relay goes down for whatever reason, another relay in range can pass along the message to where it need to go.

        By the by, this is also how the internet works (oversimplified to the point of inaccuracy of course).

        In building out a Zigbee network you do not want to create chains with a single path available for reliability reasons. It’s better saturate an area with Zigbee relays. The relays can be either bunched up or you can spread them out. The only limiting factor on the size (in sq meters) is the max number of devices of the protocol, which you are unlikely to hit, and the radio range of the individual relays. Each device (either a relay or end device) needs to be able to see at least one (but preferably more than one) relay.

        At a high level (I don’t run one myself), A Zigbee to MQTT server is a way to create a second “net” that is completely separate from the your original Zigbee network. In a nutshell, you take a second Zigbee cordinator and attach it to a MQTT server which then passes the information back to your Home Assistant. This second network doesn’t benefit from the first and the first doesn’t benefit from the second. Though, because they operate on the same frequency spectrum, they can conflict just as 2.4Ghz WiFi and Zigbee can conflict.

        Can I just get a zigbee to MQTT router and that bridges between a zigbee button and HA?

        It’s more something that you build than something you get, but, practically speaking, there is nothing stopping you from doing so. Though it doesn’t usually make sense to do so from an effort or infrastructure prospective for a single end device. Though of course, there are always exceptions. At a minimum, you would need a network connected computer running the MQTT server and a second Zigbee coordinator. Search for zigbee2mqtt.

      • Using Z2M doesn't really sound like it'd be ideal for your use case. For most people (myself included) it's to seperate your zigbee network from home assistant so if HASS goes down you don't lose control of your lights too.

      • have a look at Shelley smart devices. They have a wifi button that’s fully compatible with Home Assistant. Not the cheapest in the world but the quality is excellent. No Zigbee needed.

        https://www.shelly.com/en

  • The bit of info missing here is that ZigBee is a meshing network, as said most (but not all) mains powered ZigBee devices are routers. That means any end devices will connect to a router if it's closer and the router will relay the message back, that could be directe or via another router.

    To fix your issue, some well placed ZigBee plugs could be all you need.

    • There aren't really any nice places to put the smart plugs. They are bulky and make it annoying for anyone trying to use that socket (or the one next to it), and ones in the open get knocked out by kids running past. Plus the ones I have don't have great range, a few metres (10ft or so) at best before they start getting dodgy. My skyconnect is unfortunately in one corner of the house where the raspberry pi and router are, and i want the button in a spot on the opposite side of the house. If the smart plugs do 3 metres each then I'd probably need 4 or 5 of them since the sockets aren't placed in a straight line between the two points, and it needs to go through 3 or 4 walls depending on placement. Hence why I was hoping for some way of jumping across the house using wifi.

28 comments